How I went from financial App failure to finding success on the App Store

[luniac]

No there isn't. Literally choose your font, picture and type.

Oh and your credit card details

well ill give it a shot
i hope its not prohibitively expensive, i got some money to burn cause i live like a fat priest(im not fat), but i got limits lol

thanks

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[teabag]

well ill give it a shot
i hope its not prohibitively expensive, i got some money to burn cause i live like a fat priest(im not fat), but i got limits lol

thanks

It will burn as long as you keep fuelling it.

When I used it, I budgeted with $400. I didn't get a positive response, so I've moved on. Personally though, If I could go 'back in time', I would've used that money on Facebook Advertising instead.

 

[Kevin Peter]

Am on a similar lane. Building an app that solicits your bank account transactional SMS information and gives you an notification on the cash flow and the savings detail on the end of the month. Looking forward to monetize it after 3 years, until then it is free for every possible user across the world.

 

[DaRK9]

Am on a similar lane. Building an app that solicits your bank account transactional SMS information and gives you an notification on the cash flow and the savings detail on the end of the month. Looking forward to monetize it after 3 years, until then it is free for every possible user across the world.

Or you could find investors, use the money to get a much larger user base faster via marketing, and charge in 6/mo-one/yr.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[BrooklynHustle]

Am on a similar lane. Building an app that solicits your bank account transactional SMS information and gives you an notification on the cash flow and the savings detail on the end of the month. Looking forward to monetize it after 3 years, until then it is free for every possible user across the world.

Why did you choose 3 years?

As someone with a fair bit of experience in this arena (over 8M downloads and $800k from the App Store) I would highly recommend that you attempt monetization much sooner.

1. The Mobile Industry moves extremely fast, and the keys to success today may not hold true in even six months. I have witnessed & been affected by big shifts several times

2. You want to know if your users value your product/service enough to pay for it ASAP. It would be a shame to wait 3 years to find out they really want something different. Find a way to get this information FAST

Best of luck!

 

[Kevin Peter]

Thank you for the honest feedback! Let me work something and get in-touch with you for more guidance.

 

[aaron bowe]

I spent 4 months developing my last app to perfection, building a fancy website, setting up support, only to have it completely flop. So painful, and it wasn't the first time I've done it.

I knew I needed better process, so I've since been seeking a more "lean" approach to the infamous anti-lean App Store.

In contrast, the initial release of my next app GifShare took 6 days to build, had no fancy features, minimal design, and was pretty buggy. Yet it was doing $800/month (now up to $1,200/month a month later).

So what did I change? How did I learn to ship faster more profitably?

1. Validate - I setup a landing page using the service QuickMVP which took maybe 10 minutes. I setup an ugly v1 of the App icon on it which took an hour. The point of the page was to convey what the purpose of the app did, and to see if people would click through to get the app.

2. Test - I wanted to see if I could drive traffic to the landing page with minimal effort. GifShare's proposed purpose was to allow posting GIFs to Instagram, so I search google for things like "post gifs to instagram".

I found things like blog posts, youtube videos, and Yahoo! answers where I left a comment saying "This app is built specifically for this - [app link]"

The way QuickMVP helps you test is, if enough people click through and give you your email in a certain time period, then your idea is "validated". For me to find this idea worth building, I wanted to see if I could get 50 emails in 3 days.

I got double that (101 emails). With less than 3 hours of total work.

3. Build - The important part about building is that you build NO MORE than a minimally working version. I marketed "Post GIFs to Instagram" so I built just that in its simplest form.

I did it this way because it would take me less time -- and if I solved the problem in its basic form in a way that would generate revenue for me. If the business model wasn't panning out, I at least didn't waste time or energy to figure it out.

I've since added extra features and tweaked the app a bit to do $400/month than it originally was doing.

There's a lot more complexities to the process, so feel free to ask questions. I'd love to discuss.

Believe it or not those numbers are actually better than most of the unsuccess stories I have read about the app store. I personally have been working on developing my own apps for the app store as it is a huge market and a goal of mine to get my own app on the app store. My question for you is how did you learn to develop apps? Did you have any college education or are you self taught? I'd love to know your process from beginning to end because that is actually a major accomplishment my friend. Don't underestimate yourself or forget to pat yourself on the back for accomplishments such as this. It's a process. Learn, grow, execute.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[James Thornton]

Rep+ because validation is the cheat code.

Thanks for the post, gave me an idea

 

[AceNZ]

Hey guys,

Great thread. There are a lot of gems that all of you provide - and it is definitely insightful.

Having read through the posts in this thread, it appears that there is an overwhelming case for validating your idea (or product) first before proceeding with the execution. However, I have a question around this.

If a potential customer hits your website through your ad words, signs up to your website and then realises that the product doesn't exist yet but "could" happen in the future, wouldn't you be pissed off as a customer? Wouldn't you think it was a waste of time having navigated through your website?

In other words, wouldn't the customer just think to themselves "Oh! This website doesn't really solve my need yet. Screw it - this site is useless to me. I will close it and find another website that solves my need".

I am just concerned about placing ad words and directing customers to my site only for them to find out that the product doesn't exist yet.

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[vitality11]

I spent 4 months developing my last app to perfection, building a fancy website, setting up support, only to have it completely flop. So painful, and it wasn't the first time I've done it.

I knew I needed better process, so I've since been seeking a more "lean" approach to the infamous anti-lean App Store.

In contrast, the initial release of my next app GifShare took 6 days to build, had no fancy features, minimal design, and was pretty buggy. Yet it was doing $800/month (now up to $1,200/month a month later).

So what did I change? How did I learn to ship faster more profitably?

1. Validate - I setup a landing page using the service QuickMVP which took maybe 10 minutes. I setup an ugly v1 of the App icon on it which took an hour. The point of the page was to convey what the purpose of the app did, and to see if people would click through to get the app.

2. Test - I wanted to see if I could drive traffic to the landing page with minimal effort. GifShare's proposed purpose was to allow posting GIFs to Instagram, so I search google for things like "post gifs to instagram".

I found things like blog posts, youtube videos, and Yahoo! answers where I left a comment saying "This app is built specifically for this - [app link]"

The way QuickMVP helps you test is, if enough people click through and give you your email in a certain time period, then your idea is "validated". For me to find this idea worth building, I wanted to see if I could get 50 emails in 3 days.

I got double that (101 emails). With less than 3 hours of total work.

3. Build - The important part about building is that you build NO MORE than a minimally working version. I marketed "Post GIFs to Instagram" so I built just that in its simplest form.

I did it this way because it would take me less time -- and if I solved the problem in its basic form in a way that would generate revenue for me. If the business model wasn't panning out, I at least didn't waste time or energy to figure it out.

I've since added extra features and tweaked the app a bit to do $400/month than it originally was doing.

There's a lot more complexities to the process, so feel free to ask questions. I'd love to discuss.

Thank you so much for sharing your story and to all of the great folks who have contributed to the post. You are a living example and inspiration.
I am learning a lot from you. The generosity of your wisdom is truly humbling. Thank you all.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Rayray4546]

Yes

I'm in the process of building my own mvp. I was wondering why you chose to have an LLC company vs sole sole proprietorship. I'm trying to get insight on which route to take. I don't except to make much right away but eventually would want an app business. BTW thanks for posting about your experience its great learning from other ppl.

 

[workinprogress]

Great example of why you should create MVPs for your business.
What would you say was your risk if none opted in while doing the trial run? 3 hours for free marketing and 1 for the whole setup?

Now some more ideas to make more money:

• Did you contact app review blogs / Youtubers to review the app?
• Increase the app price to 1.99, then contact 'App Deal of the Day' apps to get free promotion (for example this http://appgratis.com/). You'll get more reach and as you monetize the app via IAP it won't hurt you. Just don't forget to decrease the price after the promotion again.
• Try to find out what your audience looks like. It's not easy, but it's very the money is at. If you know what your audience looks like you'll see tons of opportunities to make money money off your app by cross promoting a new app. You can do this by asking your audience simple questions about their life (3 choices, one tap will select and trigger the answer) every 10th time they use your app. This will be a little bit tricky to put together in the backend but gives you valuable insights.
• Also try to get them to either opt in via email (best but hardest), Facebook page like or Twitter. If you can reach your audience through different channels you can get tons of downloads for your next app within a day (for free).

Replying to this post to save it. New here, let me know if that's not allowed or if there is some sort of better way to do this.

 

[WakingUp]

Thank you for sharing your experience.

I have a couple ideas in mind for something similar--the validation process seems like it can cut down on some failed attempts.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[hatzil]

1.if you would need to outsource your app(to build the very first version)- in assumption that this first version is easy to make, would you outsoruce an amateur programmer and have professional QA go over it? or would you advice gettin a professional from the start? or any other way.
2.Do you know a way to make income before the app is on the play store?(for example, is it possible to put ads before uploading to the play store?)
3.Can you estimate how much income i get from app with 100 users that click one advertisement per day or view 100 per day?

Rob, I appreciate your time and effort, thank you
Ofir

 

[Rcaraway1989]

1.if you would need to outsource your app(to build the very first version)- in assumption that this first version is easy to make, would you outsoruce an amateur programmer and have professional QA go over it? or would you advice gettin a professional from the start? or any other way.
2.Do you know a way to make income before the app is on the play store?(for example, is it possible to put ads before uploading to the play store?)
3.Can you estimate how much income i get from app with 100 users that click one advertisement per day or view 100 per day?

Rob, I appreciate your time and effort, thank you
Ofir

1. Shitty programmers will build shitty products. Would not recommend ever.
2. Nope unless you collect money via some kind of kickstarter like funding service
3. 100 users will generate almost nothing. Ads require massive traffic. In app purchases are your best bet.

 

[RJ the first]

1. Shitty programmers will build shitty products. Would not recommend ever.
2. Nope unless you collect money via some kind of kickstarter like funding service
3. 100 users will generate almost nothing. Ads require massive traffic. In app purchases are your best bet.

So I have to ask for your opinion, as this is a subject I've been doing a lot of thinking on lately.

I've been reading a lot of blogposts and such about the odds of making money by starting a mobile app business

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-worth-it-to-enter-the-mobile-apps-business-now-Is-it-too-late
https://www.quora.com/Is-it-possibl...er-to-make-a-living-off-the-App-Store-in-2016
http://dazeend.org/2015/01/the-shape-of-the-app-store/
http://readwrite.com/2015/07/20/indie-app-developers-success-enterprise-the-man/
https://tyler.io/a-candid-look-at-the-financial-side-of-building-mac-apps-on-your-own/

There's tons more like this that seem to suggest it's harder these days to make money as an indie developer on the App Store - as there's more competition and most of the money goes to apps made by large companies with huge teams of developers and huge marketing budgets.

This is discouraging to me as my fastlane plan, initially, was to start my own mobile development business to 1. develop my own app ideas and sell them on the app store or 2. use my apps as a sort of 'portfolio' I can use to solicit contracting work making mobile apps for small businesses.
https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/software-dev-in-chicago.70118/

I have been hard at work on my first set of apps, they are almost ready to go. But I put a lot of work into them and once they're launched I then have to start marketing them. I may not make much money back, as my monetization strategy is a 'freemium' model with in app advertising.

I even talked to a 'business coach' - a certain well known startup blogger who I hired for coaching several days ago. He told me that the monetization you get from apps is not worth the time that you put into making them and marketing them. He advised me to look into other businesses like affiliate marketing and posting online learning courses.

All of a sudden my passionate idea to start my own mobile app dev business does not seem like a wise investment at all, given the effort vs the potential reward. It also doesn't seem very 'fastlane' to be taking a road that everyone seems to be taking, and with very uncertain chances of success.

Do you still believe in 2016 it's worth it to get into the app business? given my goal is financial freedom. Right now I'm sort of weighing if it's worth it to push through with my mobile app dev business plan, or if I would be better off trying to think of another plan at this time. I'm still committed to getting my first set of apps in the app store - but I'm not expecting them to turn over much money - as I basically did them as a learning experience, and did not do much market research before starting. I was planning to really focus on the marketing and them refine my approach with my next set of apps.

Any comments on this are appreciated. Thanks!

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Crissco]

I believe money can be made anyway, people say websites are dead, thats the furthest thing from the truth. Just my opinion, even if it doesnt work out, its still worth a shot to give it a go, worst that happens you learn a crop load, win win

 

[RJ the first]

Crissco-

But is it wise to go into a business endeavor, especially one that requires so much work, without seriously weighing out the pros and cons? First rule MJ and authors like Chad Mureta would tell you is to do your market research first. I understand wanting to move forward with the app business because it's cool and technically interesting to me. So it may be a fun hobby. But as something you may invest a ton of your time and money into as a potential fast lane business, it may not be the best path.

Also websites aren't dead but not all websites are started as fast lane businesses, and it's very easy to start a new website, as easy as registering a dns address and signing up for Wordpress. A new app takes much more time and investment.

 

[Crissco]

I only say it for the learning experience, im a web developer so im all about learning. Coming from a business point of view, of course do research, but reality is even the dumbest shit takes off, it really does. As long as its marketed correctly. Clickbait headlines and visual content, think buzzfeed. I know theres something im missing here and im looking at it from a bias point of view but to ME, its a win win no matter what. Potential money maker, learning experience. - Also just to make things clear, im talking about coding it yourself, not hiring someone.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[RJ the first]

I only say it for the learning experience, im a web developer so im all about learning. Coming from a business point of view, of course do research, but reality is even the dumbest shit takes off, it really does. As long as its marketed correctly. Clickbait headlines and visual content, think buzzfeed. I know theres something im missing here and im looking at it from a bias point of view but to ME, its a win win no matter what. Potential money maker, learning experience. - Also just to make things clear, im talking about coding it yourself, not hiring someone.

Yeah I am coding myself, if I wanted to hire outsourcers it would be done in half the time (probably not as well though). That's the one advantage going for me. Other people would have to pay thousands to contractors to get this 'learning experience'.

And I could go into something like - investing thousands into something like Amazon reselling, or affiliate marketing, only to fail at that too. So why not go into something I know and can do without having to invest a lot of my own money?

The downside is time I could be spending on something that may be more lucrative, more quickly. I'm really hoping you guys can convince me otherwise on this. I'm really interested in mobile apps as a developer, and I don't mind learning the marketing side of things. I'm not particularly enthused about going into something like 'affiliate marketing' just for the chance to make money more quickly.

 

[Crissco]

Yeah I am coding myself, - If it fails, you have development as a back up, if it succeeds you can do freelance work for extra income to market and advertise the app - ALL of my projects failed, want to know why? Lack of focus on one thing, I have a lot of ideas im a 90%er, its horrible, i get traffic then go to next idea...Its not good, its my own problems but I learned ALOT and I mean ALOT in the past 4 years about internet marketing, web development, targeted traffic and this is only the begging..Worst part I have zero income, no job right now and I have to pay rent...Sorry for that rant. Lol..Im going off of what my experiences are and the millionaires I have worked with a know personally. DRIVE - What drives YOU to succeed?


And I could go into something like - investing thousands into something like Amazon reselling, or affiliate marketing, only to fail at that too. So why not go into something I know and can do without having to invest a lot of my own money? - To put an app on the android store is $25, start there see how it goes, then if it goes well, create an IOS app - Its all a risk, high risk high reward..But of course it has to be calculated as well, with research


The downside is time I could be spending on something that may be more lucrative, more quickly. I'm really hoping you guys can convince me otherwise on this. I'm really interested in mobile apps as a developer, and I don't mind learning the marketing side of things. I'm not particularly enthused about going into something like 'affiliate marketing' just for the chance to make money more quickly. --Im the same way not into affiliate marketing, I can drive traffic, recently I just hit 700 visitors to one my sites in a week, ZERO conversions, so something is off, I didnt do market research at all..So now what im gonna do is A/B split testing on the site AND add a digital product for $10 because there are needs in the niche I chose, and it will only take me a week since i used WordPress. Again a learning experience, people are willing to pay $10 for something small, see its good then sign up for something such a $299 monlthy maintenance plan as an example - Im talking


This is just my over positive attitude talking / combined with my experience but I believe damn near anything is possible, ive seen it infront of my own eyes, a company thats 6 years old pulling in 30 million. - Its a LEGIT stressful business but if it works it works, i sure as hell know im willing to put in 6 years of work to make millions to retire at 35 and sell the company.

 

[RJ the first]

I'm still hoping other people will come into this thread and help me feel more confident about my business plan of starting a mobile app business in 2016. I'm still sort of unsure whether going into the mobile game is worth investing all my time and money - if my goal is financial freedom or at least a really good side income. It took 4 weeks to create one app (well - 3 apps because I can reskin it and release them as 3 separate apps). And the realistic potential for those apps right now is - close to $0 after figuring in development costs. I mean I like developing apps because it's fun - but as a source of income it's hard for an individual developer without some financial backing.

Taking in the current economic climate for indie developers in the App store - it's a little like in TMF where MJ talks about the 'fallacy of do what you love'. How some people think they're going to be successful at something simply because 'you love it'. An equivalent to this would be - someone who enjoys martial arts thinking he is going to make fastlane money by starting a martial arts studio or something like that. MJ explicitly warns about situations like this in the book. I don't want to get caught in that trap.

Of course my situation with the mobile apps dev business is a little different. My current set of apps is just a learning experience. But eventually I want to refine my pre-development market research so that I am solving real world problems and fulfilling a need for other people. This part of the equation is a little sketchy for me right now.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[hatzil]

I'm very confused on all the legal stuff, I hired a bad developer who didn't deliver what I want. and now I want to hire a designer from dribbble.com with an agreement upfront. I currently have a prototype made on powerpoint ready
1. Do you know how to deal with or have any tool relating to payments- invoices,digital signatures for agreements? ( I really never dealt with employees..)
2. Do you recommend setting an agreement upfront with the designer/developer by a lawyer(I know this may sound expensive and not worth an agreement, but I have already lost money because of a bad work. would you advice just eating the losses when it's early and moving on?)

btw, if anyone looking to get a good prototype fast and easy, I recommend the book - "Fake it or make it - amir khella" . be aware that the author wants you to buy his templates, but you can work on a prototype without it. you basically makes an actionable prototype in powerpoint/keynote

 

[iceyblitz]

Very valuable knowledge here..

I agree wasting time on a big idea sucks. My suggestion is to think about the least amount of work you can put in to validating the idea. Are people solving this problem in a more primitive way already? If so, why not interview a few and gauge their responses to see if it feels like you're on to something big.

Then, even still, you can just throw up a landing page after you've identified a target customer and see if you can get lots of emails.

Building the actual app should happen waay down the line -- until you've validated everything else.

 

[Rcaraway1989]

So I have to ask for your opinion, as this is a subject I've been doing a lot of thinking on lately.

I've been reading a lot of blogposts and such about the odds of making money by starting a mobile app business

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-worth-it-to-enter-the-mobile-apps-business-now-Is-it-too-late
https://www.quora.com/Is-it-possibl...er-to-make-a-living-off-the-App-Store-in-2016
http://dazeend.org/2015/01/the-shape-of-the-app-store/
http://readwrite.com/2015/07/20/indie-app-developers-success-enterprise-the-man/
https://tyler.io/a-candid-look-at-the-financial-side-of-building-mac-apps-on-your-own/

There's tons more like this that seem to suggest it's harder these days to make money as an indie developer on the App Store - as there's more competition and most of the money goes to apps made by large companies with huge teams of developers and huge marketing budgets.

This is discouraging to me as my fastlane plan, initially, was to start my own mobile development business to 1. develop my own app ideas and sell them on the app store or 2. use my apps as a sort of 'portfolio' I can use to solicit contracting work making mobile apps for small businesses.
https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/software-dev-in-chicago.70118/

I have been hard at work on my first set of apps, they are almost ready to go. But I put a lot of work into them and once they're launched I then have to start marketing them. I may not make much money back, as my monetization strategy is a 'freemium' model with in app advertising.

I even talked to a 'business coach' - a certain well known startup blogger who I hired for coaching several days ago. He told me that the monetization you get from apps is not worth the time that you put into making them and marketing them. He advised me to look into other businesses like affiliate marketing and posting online learning courses.

All of a sudden my passionate idea to start my own mobile app dev business does not seem like a wise investment at all, given the effort vs the potential reward. It also doesn't seem very 'fastlane' to be taking a road that everyone seems to be taking, and with very uncertain chances of success.

Do you still believe in 2016 it's worth it to get into the app business? given my goal is financial freedom. Right now I'm sort of weighing if it's worth it to push through with my mobile app dev business plan, or if I would be better off trying to think of another plan at this time. I'm still committed to getting my first set of apps in the app store - but I'm not expecting them to turn over much money - as I basically did them as a learning experience, and did not do much market research before starting. I was planning to really focus on the marketing and them refine my approach with my next set of apps.

Any comments on this are appreciated. Thanks!

Forgive me for the late response,

Your fears are justified. The App Store is saturated. I don't think the App Store alone is a great fastlane option because there's generally only one option for good profits: really low margin mass market.

The way I have approached the process, I think its almost always worth taking my process and instead applying it to a web product (SaaS, informational product). I used the web to validate my business anyway, right?

There's still a place on the App Store for 2 very specific type of Entrepreneurs. Someone who loves to immerse themselves in the trends and play the speculative game (kind of like a wall street daytrader type) either buy making apps with trend keywords, or by "flipping" apps.

The other type is a well-funded company that makes their products 10x times better than anything else out there (for the photo/video category, see Prisma, Enlight).

Both of these strategies require a lot of money. For the speculative type, its LOTS of cheap programmers, designers to build LOTS of apps (or large stashes of cash to buy apps), and the other type is hiring THE BEST to make one-two AMAZING apps.

Neither of these strategies favor the entrepreneur who is just starting, with one exception. You're making a killing doing consulting work. For example, iOS programmers (me) are one of the most in demand type of developers, and knowing the business side well means I've been able to charge $10-20k per WEEK on some projects. Learning to be killer consultant is a great gateway to starting an app business if you have the patience for it.

I've recently sold my app portfolio, and am looking to just teach people what I've learned about entrepreneurship and innovation. Writing a way bigger post with more detail than this one on everything I learned.

Edit: Or my route is probably still viable but more rare. Legitimately find an idea that has demand but next to no solutions solving it. The thing I like about approaching things this way is it's not dependent on a platform. If you find a unique idea, you might find really quickly that people want a web app instead. Or an Android app.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[RJ the first]

Hey Rcaraway1989 - Thanks for responding to me. In the time since I posted that question I've made a few apps, done a ton of research, and contacted a lot of app developers online. I'm really glad you responded.

There's still a place on the App Store for 2 very specific type of Entrepreneurs. Someone who loves to immerse themselves in the trends and play the speculative game (kind of like a wall street daytrader type) either buy making apps with trend keywords, or by "flipping" apps.

So that's me above .

Have you listened to Daily Spark podcast? Muouo Okome's Mega Rock LLC company is one of my inspirations. He played the reskinning apps and keyword trend game perfectly and now that company is doing 500k a month.

The other type is a well-funded company that makes their products 10x times better than anything else out there (for the photo/video category, see Prisma, Enlight).

Both of these strategies require a lot of money. For the speculative type, its LOTS of cheap programmers, designers to build LOTS of apps (or large stashes of cash to buy apps), and the other type is hiring THE BEST to make one-two AMAZING apps.

Neither of these strategies favor the entrepreneur who is just starting, with one exception. You're making a killing doing consulting work. For example, iOS programmers (me) are one of the most in demand type of developers, and knowing the business side well means I've been able to charge $10-20k per WEEK on some projects. Learning to be killer consultant is a great gateway to starting an app business if you have the patience for it.

The basic idea for me is - since I know how to program, I can save money at least on that type of contracting work, and continue to pump out a large volume of apps, while playing the trying to rank highly for trending keywords, for less money than someone looking to do the same thing without knowing how to program. It is a ton of work doing everything yourself, though. And to really scale quickly where I want to be - with 100s of apps in my portfolio, being able to respond quickly to new trends with minimal development time - I probably need to contract out a lot of that programming work so I can focus on the marketing.

I'd eventually like to make enough money so I can follow the second path, finding a niche market with opportunity to make money as a best in class product - and base your company on iterating a single quality product instead of always hopping on the 'trend' game.

Neither of these strategies favor the entrepreneur who is just starting, with one exception. You're making a killing doing consulting work. For example, iOS programmers (me) are one of the most in demand type of developers, and knowing the business side well means I've been able to charge $10-20k per WEEK on some projects. Learning to be killer consultant is a great gateway to starting an app business if you have the patience for it.

Would also like to hear how you developed a consulting business like this. RIght now it is killing me to have to put in 50 hours a week at a boring tech job using technologies I don't care much about. At least I could be doing something I love and working for myself instead of lining someone else's pockets.

I've recently sold my app portfolio, and am looking to just teach people what I've learned about entrepreneurship and innovation. Writing a way bigger post with more detail than this one on everything I learned.

Yeah, definitely looking forward to reading it. Please check my posts, I'm basically in the early stages of trying to build a portfolio of 100s of 'trendhopping' apps, while learning about the market research and ASO side of things. I figure if I can get dozens of those kinds of apps out and do my ASO right, some of them are bound to hit.

 

[obrian]

I believe money can be made anyway, people say websites are dead, thats the furthest thing from the truth. Just my opinion, even if it doesnt work out, its still worth a shot to give it a go, worst that happens you learn a crop load, win win

Websites is far from dead. Websites are like online real estate, I have seen guys bought websites off the cheap, flip that s**t by adding some amazing features on it and a new theme.

Next they sell it for thousands. Blogging is also far from dead, you can still make lots of cash if you know how to market your content, create a brand through channels like snapchat, twitter, instagram etc.

Is it easier to become a successful blogger these days hell no, you would have to put in alot of work. That's good though because the barrier to entry is getting more deeper. This will now seperate the boys from men. If you are willig to learn the dynamics of S.E.O you can reach very far but the hard thing is, the algorithms are always changing so you got to stay on top of the trends.

In terms of apps, it's difficult for one guy in a room to pull off a successful app. It can be done, but it will take alot of self-confidence,persistence,creativity etc.

If you look at the most successful apps now, they are all becoming platforms and that's a whole different beast. But I believe in you guys, I created this game once, trying to imitate the floppy bird phenomena lol. It really flopped lol, I think there is about 1or 2 downloads for it.

 

[RJ the first]

Websites is far from dead. Websites are like online real estate, I have seen guys bought websites off the cheap, flip that s**t by adding some amazing features on it and a new theme.

Next they sell it for thousands. Blogging is also far from dead, you can still make lots of cash if you know how to market your content, create a brand through channels like snapchat, twitter, instagram etc.

Is it easier to become a successful blogger these days hell no, you would have to put in alot of work. That's good though because the barrier to entry is getting more deeper. This will now seperate the boys from men. If you are willig to learn the dynamics of S.E.O you can reach very far but the hard thing is, the algorithms are always changing so you got to stay on top of the trends.

In terms of apps, it's difficult for one guy in a room to pull off a successful app. It can be done, but it will take alot of self-confidence,persistence,creativity etc.

If you look at the most successful apps now, they are all becoming platforms and that's a whole different beast. But I believe in you guys, I created this game once, trying to imitate the floppy bird phenomena lol. It really flopped lol, I think there is about 1or 2 downloads for it.

Well just like SEO there's such a thing as ASO and it's probably just as crucial to an apps success. What you just wrote about web developers and online bloggers is just as true for app developers. It's a ton of hard work and you need to know the marketing side of things. You can't just put stuff out there.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[obrian]

Well just like SEO there's such a thing as ASO and it's probably just as crucial to an apps success. What you just wrote about web developers and online bloggers is just as true for app developers. It's a ton of hard work and you need to know the marketing side of things. You can't just put stuff out there.

Marketing is more important than ever these days. That's what killed my game I just pushed it out like that boom!!!! You have alot of good apps out there that will never see the light due to poor marketing lol. ASO seems pretty interesting, how would you normally get ASO done?

 

[Rcaraway1989]

Have you listened to Daily Spark podcast? Muouo Okome's Mega Rock LLC company is one of my inspirations. He played the reskinning apps and keyword trend game perfectly and now that company is doing 500k a month.

I' had a great chat with Muouo Okome a year or so ago. He's a spectacular guy!

Would also like to hear how you developed a consulting business like this. RIght now it is killing me to have to put in 50 hours a week at a boring tech job using technologies I don't care much about. At least I could be doing something I love and working for myself instead of lining someone else's pockets.

I'm probably not the best guy to talk about freelancing as I still think I'm actually just okay with it, and I don't do it very often. I recommend you check out https://doubleyourfreelancing.com/ if you want someone who really knows what they're talking about.

Yeah, definitely looking forward to reading it. Please check my posts, I'm basically in the early stages of trying to build a portfolio of 100s of 'trendhopping' apps, while learning about the market research and ASO side of things. I figure if I can get dozens of those kinds of apps out and do my ASO right, some of them are bound to hit.

I skimmed through your progress thread. It seems you're really serious about the "Massive app portfolio" strategy so I'll offer what advice I can - I would 100% focus on building niche apps that have less chance for massive explosions of popularity but higher chance for general success. The more specific you can define the problem the better. I'm sure you know Chad Mureta -- he's offers a premium course that I'd definitely invest in if you're 100% ready to put your money where your mouth is. I'm pretty sure it's not cheap. https://appempire.com/class-session/