Lex DeVille's: Guru Cults Exposed: The Tactics "Experts" Use To Pull You In & Suck You Dry

[Lex DeVille]

You're browsing Facebook when you see a post with a title like this:

The Biggest Mistake That Held Me Back From Hitting My First $1,000,000...
When I first started my business..........



It looks like a blog post. But you see a "read more" icon. So you click it and down pops a story.

​

No harm in reading a story, you think. So you read the first line. But...

...you don't know this harmless sentence ends in a way that opens a loop in the mind that compels you to read more. Before you know it, you've read the third, fourth, and even twenty fifth lines.

By now you know you're reading an ad or maybe not. You may even wonder why you're still reading. But how could you not finish? That's like leaving a murder mystery before the killer is revealed.

When you start a story, you want to finish it.
(unless it sucks like new Star Wars)

When there's a question in your mind, you want to answer it.
(to close the loop)

So you keep reading...

Because the story is good. And it's good because it's about you.

Technically it's the author's story, but strangely, it parallels your own. The struggles, challenges, and failures...it's like you guys live the same lives.

The only part that deviates is where they made 7 figures and you have not.
(yet)

But if you're willing to sit through a Free Master Class, they'll reveal the 5 shifts that changed everything for them and when you get it, your life will change too.

This is how it begins...

Soon you've spent an hour alone watching a guru webinar designed to open your eyes to the error of your ways and show you how simple making millions can be.
(the real purpose is to make you feel good and give you hope)

If only you make those shifts...you'll be rich...and if you want help, the guru (or their team) has set aside time to speak with you to see if you're a fit to work with them to change your life.

But you'd better do it fast because spaces are limited.

So you click a link, fill out an application, and book a call.

Fast forward 3 months and you've spent $10,000 on credit for 8 weeks of training designed to teach you how to do all the things we just talked about. Doesn't matter what you teach in your "business" as long as you follow their "process."
(Also you get access to a Facebook group usually.)

THIS IS HOW GURU CULTS OPERATE...

It's not all that different from a NOT guru cult, which makes it hard to tell the difference. The key difference is one teaches a marketing system as a successful business (but calls it something else). The other teaches processes that open the doors to building a successful business.

Sometimes the funnels they use operate almost exactly the same. The problem with guru cults is they tell you that you can do what you love and be successful while secretly selling you the very system they used to get you to buy from them (rather than selling you their personal processes about how to do what they love and how that made them millions...because it didn't).

It's kind of like an MLM...Juice Plus, Amway, Mary Kay...except people actually do make a lot of money sometimes. As long as you sell the same system you bought to some other poor sap, you'll make back your investment and then some pretty fast (after all it only takes 2 schmoozers at $5,000 each to pay off that $10,000 loan).

At the top levels this works well. The marketing gurus at the top have a lot of money to spend figuring out how to get people to spend money. It works well at the second level too, because the people buying from the top gurus have plenty of money to spend. They get their water from the well. It's when you get to the 3rd level and beyond that things start to go to shit.

At the 3rd level you've got marketing training mixed with "business" and "branding" and "spiritual awakenings." Now things start to get muddy. These people still sell the dream, but they don't have as much money to spend on training, or marketing, so they turn to their personal network and start there.

At first they make a few sales from friends or family (this is what the top-tier gurus suggest they do to gain traction fast). But soon they run out of people to sell to and they stop making money.

So they turn back to the marketing systems. They try Facebook ads but don't have much to spend, so it doesn't work very well. They try promoting themselves all over Facebook and social media but that doesn't work well either. Also, by this time it's been so long since they first started this path, that they forgot half the shit they learned in their training...

The only logical solution therefore is to return to their guru because they've "tried everything" but something still holds them back (you'll find that line in their customer emails). Lucky for them, the guru is hosting a 2 day seminar in the Himalayas and it's just $30,000 to attend................

Anyone notice a pattern?

Anyway...

There are plenty of legit coaches, courses and trainings out there. There's also a F*ck ton of bullshit gurus and wannabes selling crackpot systems they don't understand to people they can't help.

In the posts that follow (and when I have time) I'm going to break down each part of the guru funnels, and the tactics and techniques they use to indoctrinate you into their cults and keep you there while practically stealing your cash.

Hopefully this thread will save some of you a lot of wasted time and cash, and help you make good judgments and buying decisions anytime you consider a training moving forward.

WHERE DID I GET THESE SECRET INSIGHTS?

I've worked directly with gurus at all levels. Built their funnels. Wrote their copy. Trained their students, and even launched courses and coaching programs of my own using some of their methods.

Also, I've bought courses from gurus, and through a rigorous process of due diligence have managed to only purchase useful shit up to this point. So hopefully some of those insights will help you.

Anyway, if you have any questions about gurus, or about a program you're considering taking, feel free to post them here. It's been a while since I spent time giving value to this forum, and this seems like a fair way to give back.

Even if you don't have questions right now, maybe you'll learn something from the posts that follow.

In the next post we'll look at some guru ads and break down different psychological tactics of influence and persuasion used to pull you in and suck you dry.

If that interests you, stay tuned...

P.S.

Look again at the ad above. Is it a BS guru, or does she sell a legit training program that might be useful for you? Consider it carefully. I'll tell you the answer in the next post.

@Andy Black @MJ DeMarco

Could you move this to the outside. Sorry about that. Thought I double checked and had it in the right forum.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

Let's Talk Guru Funnels Stage 1 - The Ad
​

Common Guru Funnel Variations

V1. Ad > Landing Page > Email Series > Webinar > Application > Call > Sale
V2. Ad > Landing Page > Webinar > Application > Call > Sale
V3. Ad > Landing Page > Webinar > Sales Page > Sale

There are versions that don't start with an ad, but you won't see those as often. The Tier 1 (marketing) Gurus, such as Russ Ruffino, teach their students to get to the sale as fast as possible. That starts with ads. More specifically, almost always Facebook ads.

The Facebook Ad sits in the Attention stage of the AIDA model.

It's placed directly in your line of site as you scroll. Sometimes it's short, like this Tony Robbins ad.

Or long like our Selena Soo ad from yesterday.

Gurus use whatever their guru says works. So you'll end up seeing a lot of variations since Tier 1 gurus trickle down their marketing results from the top. Whether the ad is short or long isn't important. What's important are the words you read as you're scrolling by.

If you're seeing guru ads on Facebook, it's because:

A) You fit the guru's target demographic for an ideal client
(you're a juicy antelope being stalked by Simba)

B) You visited a guru site, clicked a link, or liked a guru post etc.
(now you're a juicy antelope with a broken leg)

In either case you're being targeted and that puts you at a major disadvantage. It's the same thing that makes an assassin lethal. The victim isn't looking for a hitman. Meanwhile, there's a man on a building a mile away with sights on your head. He watches your behavior and gets to know you better than you know yourself. That way he can strike when you've dropped your guard.

When you fit a guru's ideal client profile, it's not hard for them to say what you want to read. All they have to do is find people just like you and get to know them well. They spend time getting to know their problems. They learn how those people describe the problem in their own words. Then they use those exact same words in all of their communications with you.

Let's revisit the Tony Robbins ad from above...

"Failing to plan means planning to fail" - This is an agreement statement. You won't disagree with this. Remember, you're being targeted. This is likely something you've said to yourself in your head. Maybe you even said it out loud or online to someone else. Since you agree, it probably grabs your attention which is enough to get you to continue the first line.

"Do you really have a business - or just a job you're calling a business" - Here is where the loop opens in your mind. This is another statement you say to yourself, especially if you're someone struggling in business. I see a similar question like this about freelancing all the time:

"Is freelancing really a business or is it just a job I'm calling a business?"

There's a good chance that's why Tony's ads target me. I'm a freelancer and I ask freelancer questions. So all Tony's ads have to do is say what I'm already thinking. Suddenly it's like he knows me and that hits home.

The thing is, I don't have an answer for the question. If I did, I wouldn't ask it. Since I don't have an answer, and since Tony posed the question, I automatically assume Tony might have the answer and therefore I keep reading.

That's why the very next sentence goes straight into a possible solution.

"Discover the essential strategies..." - This is a command that continues to hint at a solution, but doesn't close the loop. The loop can only be closed when you have the actual answer. Otherwise it remains open, plaguing your thoughts. But now you not only have the open loop of your own troubling question, but also the open loop of a possible solution that hasn't been revealed but easily could be...if only you sign up for that free webinar.

Isn't it crazy how all that psychology goes into a simple 5 line Facebook ad?

By the way, some ads use videos. Some don't. Tony's usually do. The videos are similar to the copywriting in what they say. They just say more of the key words and phrases you want to read. Then they hint at a solution inside. Make sense?

Now let's go deeper with a longer ad.

It's back to the Selena Soo ad. This ad looks more like a Tier 2 or 3 guru ad. The first line opens with something her target audience is already thinking about.

"When I first started my business" - This isn't about her business. It's targeting YOU by letting YOU know that this is a story about the starting phase of a business which happens to be where YOU are if you're seeing this ad.

"I was afraid of coming across as" - 1 loop opens here. It happens REALLY FAST. It opens at the cliffhanger "as" and you don't think twice about dropping to the next line to find out what she was afraid of coming across as. You just read it.

"arrogant" - The loop closes here, but another one opens because now you have to know why she felt that way. This word specifically targets how her audience feels. It could've been any other word.

- "An a**hole"
- "A fake"
- "A fraud"
- "Intrusive"

Whatever word fits the audience. Whatever word the target uses to describe themselves. Those exact words and phrases identify the target's limiting beliefs. These are stuck points that we want to solve but don't know how. When someone mentions them, they get our attention.

Okay...

That's pretty F*cking deep...

But now I'll show you something that will blow your mind...

The rest of Selena's ad is a story.

Harmless.

Right?

No.

This isn't just any story.

This story applies a therapeutic metaphor technique to bypass any reservations you currently have.

You may not know this, but people understand things through other things. If I just say you're being targeted by gurus, that doesn't describe the severity of the situation. But if I call a guru an assassin and you the victim, or them a lion and you the antelope...that paints a clearer picture in your mind. You understand the comparison.

So here's how guru stories work.

POWERFUL THERAPEUTIC METAPHORS

A metaphor uses a story in which a character (in this case the guru) represents the situation you're currently in. They describe that situation very clearly. It seems the story isn't about you, it's about the character (but it's really about you).

Once the story begins, you read how the character has all of the exact problems you have. This causes you to identify with the character. Now the two of you are one as you continue this journey. This also triggers the psychological rule of "liking" because the character is like you.

But unlike you, the character's story ends differently, and this is where the magic happens. Up until this point, you had a bunch of open loops lingering in your mind. All the questions you don't have answers for. All the problems that have you stuck. The character has all those same problems, yet their outcome was different.

Why?

It was a simple realization they had...

"If I wanted a business that would REALLY help people, I HAD to put myself out there."

That's how therapeutic metaphors work. But what effect does it have on you? Remember, you've identified with the protagonist of the story. You have the same situation. Since everything was the same except that ONE REALIZATION, you assume the solution to your problem must therefore be the same.

In this case...

YOU MUST PUT YOURSELF OUT THERE if you want your business to succeed.

Not only does this suggest what you must do, it also PRIMES you for what's to come. Because now, if at any point in this funnel you have doubts, you'll remember the story. You'll remember how the character had to put herself out there before she got results. Then you'll apply that same thought process to your present situation.

Should I click this ad? = That would be putting myself out there, right? Yes.
Should I enroll in this webinar? = That would be putting myself out there, right? Yes.
Should I book a call? = That would be putting myself out there, right? Yes.
Should I take out a $5k loan? = That would be putting myself out there, right? Yes.
Should I go all-in with this $30,000 retreat = That would be putting myself out there, right? Yes.

There's a reason they're called therapeutic metaphors. It's because they're used by actual medical practitioners in therapy to create change. Unfortunately, these same techniques are also used by marketers and gurus. The marketers often know what they're doing (though it doesn't make them well intentioned). Tier 2 and Tier 3 gurus usually don't have a clue.

Anyway, all of this leads you to click their ad and that's step 1.

In the next post we'll cover some different guru landing pages and see how they draw you into their funnels at the next level. If you have any questions about the stuff we talked about today, post 'em down below.



.

.

P.S.

Selena Soo's S3 program is pretty good. It taught me how to pitch media outlets like blogs, podcasts, magazines, and even local and national news outlets. But most who read her ad won't be able to tell the difference between her training and bullshit training based on theory instead of real-world results. That's why it's so important to Google the guru, and ask due diligence questions before moving forward in their funnels. Selena's ad could've been any of 1000 other gurus who would charge just as much for something worth a lot less.

By the way, when I said I'd tell you the answer about Selena's ad in the next post...and you read all the way down here today...you directly experienced how open loops work. Now the loop is closed, but it kind of makes you wonder...how many loops were opened before you reached this point? How many loops are opened every day that you don't pay any attention to until it's too late?



Later

 

[Lex DeVille]

ENTER THE CULT - THE NEARLY UNSTOPPABLE POWER OF WEBINARS ​

Tier 1 gurus teach most of their techniques to students. They'll show you how to use Authority and Future Pacing and Framing. But there's one thing they won't tell you. No Tier 1 guru ever mentions how they studied cult indoctrination. They also don't mention how those techniques are applied in their webinars (as well as every webinar their students create).

Lucky for you, I'm the guy who trained their students how to structure, write, and build their webinars for maximum impact. And fair warning...I've studied cult indoctrination.

So today's lesson is on webinars. I'll show you both sides of the technique patterns. From influence and persuasion, to NLP, and finally cult indoctrination. We may have to break this one into multiple parts.

WEBINARS HAPPEN IN PHASES

Any Guru who's been trained doesn't just make a webinar. There's a structure and format they follow. It's been tried and tested over many years even before the internet. Digital marketing has simply optimized it. A couple things you need to know:

1) Most webinars are NOT designed to give you answers (they create questions).
2) Most webinars are NOT meant to give value (they're meant to sell to you).
3) Most webinars are structured to shift you from curious onlooker to card ready buyer.

Breaking down a full webinar slide by slide would take forever. So we'll look at the sections you'll find in most webinars instead. This will give you a high-level overview that you can carry forward if ever you find yourself in a webinar funnel. The phases of a webinar are:

Phase 0 - Pre Webinar
Phase 1 - Introduction, Targeting, & Promises
Phase 2 - Reframing, Future Pacing, & Authority
Phase 3 - The Magical Life-Altering Shifts
Phase 4 - Recap, The Choice, Close



PHASE 0 - PRE WEBINAR

Pre-webinar happens when you first enter the room. You open the screen and you either get a live person or not. Either way, the speaker begins establishing authority instantly before the webinar starts. They do this by saying, "Hi John, Hi Mark, Hi Cindy...we'll get started in a moment."

Usually you won't have access to the other participants. You might not have any way to know if this webinar is pre-recorded or live. But the speaker mentions people by name so everyone watching knows (believes) there are other people watching even if no one else is there (including the speaker lol!).

This technique helps put you at ease. You feel like you're not the only fool in the room. Plus, if others are watching, this person must be someone others thought was worth listening to. So maybe it's worth a few more minutes of your time, because who knows...this might be the webinar that changes everything for you.

This tactic is especially useful for unknown gurus, but even well-knowns use it.

One other thing that happens in this phase is the guru says something like:

"To get the most out of this webinar, be sure to silence your phone and close out other screens. Make sure you have time to watch in a quiet place away from other distractions. Give me your undivided attention so you can come away with profound insights."

Yes, they want your attention, but there's more to it than that. By closing out other distractions, you don't just give your attention. You give your focused attention to the ideas they want you to consume (mainly that following their words and their system will pave the way to riches). This is another Cialdini approved presuasion method.



PHASE 1 - TARGETING & PROMISES

When the webinar begins, the speaker either gives a very brief introduction, or skips it for now. Then they go straight into targeting so they can grab their ideal client's attention. This happens in one to two slides usually titled "Who This Is For."

Who This Is For:

This is for anyone who wants to make millions selling books about topics they aren't qualified to sell. Coaches, consultants, NLP practitioners, middle age dude with the beer gut watching from your couch in your underwear. If you use insights you don't have to create unique breakthroughs for other people, then this is for you...​

If you fit the description, then they have your attention, even if only for a moment. After that the webinar continues straight into promises. First a series of slides with small promises and then a big promise at the end.

My Promise To You:

Today I'll show you how to turn your ability to use vague language and minimal research to build a 6-figure business selling kindle books even if that seems impossible right now. I'll show you how to become a best-selling author practically overnight without spending years learning the trade. I'll also show you how to put yourself on a path to your first $1,000 $2,000 or $10,000 months as quickly as possible.

My promise to you is to show you a step-by-step strategy to 6 figures per month.

​

The promises are always something they know their ideal target wants. They know this because they've researched it (as you've already seen). They've spent time figuring out exactly what this person wants to hear and conveniently, that's exactly what they say.

At this point your interest is peaked, but you're still skeptical and cautious. You know at some point they'll probably try to sell you something. Gurus know you know this. Which is why the next slide is this...

There Is Nothing For Sell
But if you stay to the end, you will get a free gift.
​

This isn't a lie. There's nothing for sell...on this webinar. But by the end they will pitch for your cash. This slide is to help you drop your guard for now. It also uses future pacing to incentivize you to stay to the end.

Before they can sell to you, they have to get you to be open to the idea of being sold to. That starts by changing your beliefs about what this webinar is. Once you believe there's nothing for sale you have no reason not to believe this webinar might actually offer real value.



PHASE 2 - REFRAME, FUTURE PACING, SUMMARY, AUTHORITY

Knowing there's nothing for sale, and there's a gift at the end, you become more interested. A key moment opens up, and now the webinar hits you in the gut with pain points. So the next couple of slides cover your pains as you describe them.

Does This Sound Like You?

Do you write long direct-response stories on popular forums about your expertise, but still people won't buy? Do you post direct response paid ads, and sometimes people buy, but you don't make millions? Do you have some months where cash pours in, but you can't maintain it? Are you struggling to bring in a consistent flow of clients no matter how hard you try?

DO YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE 100% ON THE RIGHT PATH BUT NOBODY CARES?

​

So they've brought you face to face with your pain. They've said all the things you say to yourself when you're laying in bed at night. They replace your "whys?" with their "do you?"

And then they blow your mind...

THE REAL PROBLEM?
You haven't made the "shifts" yet...
​

OH SNAP!

This simple reframe is a real eye-opener. It says everything you thought was the problem, isn't the real problem. Since you were wrong about the problem, it suddenly makes sense why your solutions didn't work. But now you have a question...what are the shifts??? dun dun dun...

Right after that slide you'll move into future pacing slides. They won't tell you what the shifts are just yet. Instead, they tell you what you'll get once you make those shifts. This allows you to imagine that future and how much better it will be.

There's another NLP technique used here too. It's called a presupposition. Presuppositions are assumptions about events that will occur. In this case it is presupposed that you will be making these shifts at some point. Sales gurus would call it assuming the sale.

ONCE YOU MAKE IT...

You'll be able to package your overnight insights into 2,000 word ebooks that break the payment system from so many buyers. You'll have as many clients as you want every single month on autopilot without you doing anything. You'll hit 6 or 7 or 12-figures whenever you're ready for it. Your bank account will skyrocket and you'll be able to afford a biosphere home on the moon. AND you'll do all of this while remembering the beautiful joy of what it means to be a true entrepreneur.

​

By now the webinar is about a 3rd of the way complete. At this point you might start to wonder if you're getting anywhere. Gurus know this.

So they move into the final part of Phase 2, authority. This is where they finally introduce themselves. They throw whatever credibility markers at you that they've got. The purpose is to prove that they are someone worth listening to, and that they can therefore help you out.

Who I Am:

I'm an NLP Master Practitioner with years of study. I've had 100,000 app downloads. I've played poker with @MJ DeMarco. I've talked to 100's of women all over the world. I've completely eliminated phobias in at least 5 people who wouldn't publicly disagree.


​

Credibility establishes authority. People listen to authorities. Credibility markers are things like big numbers, name dropping, places they've worked or been featured (Forbes, Entrepreneur) important titles, testimonials, downloads, likes, shares, etc.......

Tier 1 and Tier 2 gurus are more likely to use actually sales numbers to establish authority. Tier 3 and 4 use more vague concepts like app downloads, or number of likes and shares, so they don't have to straight up lie about sales achievements.

One other thing I've seen Tier 1 and 2 gurus add recently is some pictures of their family. They'll have a slide covering some awesome vacation they took. This helps you feel like they're a real person just like you who's just trying to give their family a good life. It also implies what the viewer will have once they make the shifts.

​

PHASE 3 - THE MAGICAL LIFE-ALTERING SHIFTS

And so...we finally reach the shifts.

The 5 (or 7 or 10 or 3) Shifts (or changes, or steps, or leaps) consume a major portion of the rest of the webinar. This is the supposed "meat and potatoes" you signed up for. Really this is just the part where they change how you think about the purchase you'll later make.

Each shift, like every other part of the webinar, follows a specific structure and contains specific information in a series of slides. With many of my past clients we used the following tactics in these slides:

1) Shock
2) Support
3) Stakes
4) Stuff
5) Story
6) Summary

Shock - They say something shocking or unexpected to get attention.
Support - They back up what they say with some kind of evidence.
Stakes - They let you know what's at stake if you do this or if you don't do this.
Stuff - This is the tiny little part of the webinar where they might teach you something of value.
Story - They reinforce what they just taught you with a story or testimonial.
Summary - They summarize the whole thing.

The structure of the 5 shifts is done in a way that lowers your guard, and prepares you to take the correct actions later on in the funnel. For that reason, you'll find the shifts usually go something like this:

SHIFT 1 - ALWAYS TRY TO HELP PEOPLE
This isn't about you helping people. It's about you believing they help people.

SHIFT 2 - CHARGE A PREMIUM
This isn't about you charging a premium. It's about you beginning to understand and accept that they charge a premium.

SHIFT 3 - USE THE SECRET TOOL
The secret tool...is webinars, and you have to agree that it works because you're still watching it!

SHIFT 4 - LEVERAGE YOUR TIME
This shift describes separating your time from your pay. But it's really about them subtly overcoming your objection to spending X amount for something that doesn't take that much time for them to deliver.

SHIFT 5 - INVEST IN MENTORING
The final shift is ALWAYS to invest in mentoring. Mentoring gives you accountability and insights and blah blah blah. If you really want to hit 12-figures, you'll need a mentor.

As you can see, these shifts are NOT designed to HELP you. They're designed to SELL you. More specifically, they prep you to be open and accepting of the upcoming sales pitch.



PHASE 4 - RECAP, A CHOICE, THE CLOSE

When you get past the 5 shifts, you're feeling good. You feel confident. You feel excited. You've just discovered some crazy insights (or so you believe). Good luck implementing them without a mentor though...

You feel a sort of high at this point. Part has to do with the webinar information. Another part has to do with the speaker him or herself. Tier 1 & 2 gurus know how to change the speed, pitch, and tone of their voice to hype you up (even though they'll say they don't do that anymore because it wasn't an ethical way to sell).

FYI...they still do it.

So now there's a couple of slides that recap the entire 5 shifts to remind you of everything you just learned, and also to explain how the guru delivered what they promised (so you don't feel cheated). Then you get a slide that says you have a choice.

Now You Have A Choice:

You can keep reverse engineering funnel after funnel, going nowhere in life, making shit pay, and having no clients and no food on the table OR....
​

AND FINALLY...

The truth comes out. Once they remind you of how shitty life is right now, they drop this bomb on you...

Here's How I Can Help:

My team and I have set aside some time to talk with you about how you can apply these ideas in your business today! And the best part? It's totally FREE!
​

After that you're almost done. You've only got a couple more slides. The final slides get more specific with targeting. You'll usually have the following:

Who This Is For
Says things about you that you would agree are true.

Who This Is Not For
Describes the kind of person you don't want to think of yourself as.

Why We're Doing This
This slide is where they first mention selling to you. They say on the call they'll talk with you about your strategy (And they will, but they won't help you refine it. We'll cover that later) and if you both think you're a fit, they may invite you to become one of the new clients they accept this month (the words "this month" add a scarcity element).

If We Work Together
This is a future pacing slide that also lets you know there will be expectations of you if you get accepted (you will be expected to conform to their standards). Again they play on scarcity and ego too. The very fact you could be denied compels you to be among the first to get your free call.

Call To Action
The final slide of the webinar is a call to action. For Tier 3 & 4 gurus, this often goes to a sales page. Tier 1 and 2 gurus know it's better to send people straight to a booking page for a call (because $10,000+ sales happen on calls).


AND THAT'S THE WAY THE COOKIE CRUMBLES BABY...

By the end of the webinar, you've gone from skeptic who's never heard of the speaker, to extremely interested, motivated, informed prospect who needs to take action RIGHT NOW before you miss your chance to get your FREE strategy session where you'll learn how you can start to apply the 5 shifts to your business (remember one of those includes getting mentoring!).

Whew...

That was quite a read.

A little bit later we'll talk more on some of the cult indoctrination that's taking place here. I'll probably just do an entire lesson that brings all of those pieces together after we finish the main funnel topics.

Up next...

The FREE Strategy Call

Stay tuned...

P.S.

Imagine you weren't a savvy Fastlane entrepreneur...you hate your job and your life. You don't know about process. You still search for events. Can you see how easy it would be to "fall" for a webinar after reading the post above? But it can happen just as easily to Fastlaners too, and that's why we're talking about it. Never think it can't happen to you. You'll be the first person it happens to.

 

[Lex DeVille]

@SinisterLexWhat can I do to improve my BS meter?

Most guru funnels follow the copywriting AIDA model - Attention Interest Desire Action - with an end goal of getting you to take action in the shortest time possible. Improving your BS meter starts with awareness, knowing what to look for. Some of those things:

1) When you read a Facebook ad and actually agree with it (that should be a red flag lol!)
2) When a Facebook ad or Master Class or free whatever specifically targets a problem(s) you have.

Those two things are signs to beware of. At this point it's time to slow down and step back. Google the webinar host to see what the world says.

• Ask "who is this guy/girl"?
• What is their experience?
• What results have they generated through the specific thing they teach?
• What are they actually teaching?
• What results have others generated by applying those skills?
• Do I get any weird gut feelings about this person?
• Do they speak in specifics or do they speak in mostly vague language?
• How long have they been teaching this thing?
• How long did they use this thing before teaching it?

That 3rd from last one is also the secret to becoming POTUS if you didn't know.

One other thing to pay attention to is how they apply credibility markers. Is what makes them sound like a great person to follow based on useless credibility markers?

A HUGE part of guru cult marketing is built on useless credibility. For instance:

Who is John Smith?

I built a 6-figure coaching business using these exact techniques - USELESS BIG NUMBER
(the system works for coaches, but what about your industry?)

I have over 10,000 instagram followers - USELESS BIG NUMBER
(so what...do you have over 10,000 sales?)

I've taught these methods to over 500 people - USELESS BIG NUMBER
(great, but did those people find it helpful?)

I trained with Tony Robbins - USELESS NAME DROPPING
(great, but will Tony Robbins be part of this in some way?)

A USEFUL version of that last one would be:
I worked with Tony Robbins to create this program.

Here's the credibility I usually look for:

I have a doctorates degree in [psychology, journalism] something relevant.
I used this system (preferably recently) to sell X amount of the thing you sell or something relevant.
I still use this system to sell X and not just [coaching, courses etc.]
Here's people you can meet and talk to before moving forward.
Here's places where you can learn more about me for free and directly experience my value.

 

[Lex DeVille]

If You Make 'Em Cry, They'll Buy.​

That's not a guru quote. It's mine. But it sums up today's topic, the Discovery Call
(AKA Breakthrough Call, Mindset Call, Strategy Call etc.)


​

If you make it to the end of the webinar, you're probably an ideal target, ahem client...This is even more true if you click the call to action to book a call while spaces are available. So where do you go from here and what can you expect next?

A high-ticket guru CTA almost always leads to one of three places.

1) A call booking page that leads to a call.
2) An application that leads to a booking page that leads to a call.
3) A long-form sales page that leads to an application page that leads to a call booking page that leads to a call.

If the CTA opens up a sales page, it usually won't lead to a checkout page. Those that do are for lower priced offers. For instance, some gurus maintain a short version of their core program for around $997. That's at the upper end of what people will pay without talking to someone most of the time.

The $997 offer is a watered down version of the full program, and it's usually reserved for those who don't buy the full program. Gurus know that once you become a customer (even at a lower price) you're more likely to buy from them again in the future. So they set up a short version of their program that doesn't give you everything you need. To get the rest you'll need to upgrade.


THE APPLICATION FORM

If you land on this page you'll find it pretty straightforward. It's a regular contact form with a bunch of questions. The form asks for your name, email, business name and other standard contact information. That's where the standard stuff ends. After that you'll get these questions:

• How much money do you make per month?
• What is your target monthly profit?
• What is your biggest obstacle to hitting reaching your target monthly profit?
• Briefly describe your current service...
• How long have you used the internet for business?
• What kind of marketing have you tried?
• Right now I...

[have the financial resources to invest in growing my business]
[have access to the financial resources to invest in growing my business]
[I don't have access to financial resources and I'm going to keep my business right where it is]

When you read these questions, you might suspect all of this is leading to a high priced offer. Most people don't even think about it because they've already had their defenses lowered on the webinar. Their beliefs about how much things should cost are already challenged. Plus they're fighting an unknown deadline for a free call.

The questions above are designed to do several things.

1) They filter out those who are most likely to get on a call and try to get free consulting.
2) They filter out those who can't pay, and filter in those who can.
3) They paint "investing" as the positive choice and not having cash as the negative choice.
4) Your answers tell the guru everything else they need to know to sell you on the call.

At the end of the form there's usually one last question that's designed to trigger the psychological rule of commitment. Those who make a written, verbal, etc. commitment are more likely to be consistent with what they said later on. Since people changing their mind and not showing up for calls wastes time and scheduling slots, gurus don't want that. So they use this box:

Our team will call at the time you choose. Please commit to your appointment by typing below:
"Yes, I promise I will answer the phone for my breakthrough session when you call."

Now that you've committed, you'll probably have to answer a stupid or silly question at the bottom. The last question is to lighten the mood. After all, the other questions just forced you to consider your current situation in life. Most people don't do that very often.

(Note: Them calling you is one more way they assume control)


THE DISCOVERY CALL



Your call might be scheduled the same day or a day or two later. Call schedulers usually won't allow you to go much beyond that. The more space between the original webinar and the call, the more likely you are to lose the little spark of motivation you had.

When you scheduled your call, the thank you page (or a follow up email) probably told you to bring pen and paper so you can take notes for all the takeaways you'll get from the call. That's to help you feel like this isn't just a sales call.

That's also why it's not called a sales call. It's reframed as a discovery or breakthrough call because that makes it about you making progress instead of them making money.

Crazy how changing a single word changes the entire meaning of things...

Anyway...

Let's talk about how discovery calls work. They happen in 4 or 5 phases depending on who you talk to. Those phases are:

Phase 1 - Intro & Rapport
Phase 2 - Discovery
Phase 3 - Qualifying
Phase 4 - Closing

Strange how closely those phases resemble a sales call.


PHASE 1 - INTRO & RAPPORT

Your call may be on the phone or it could be Skype, Zoom, or some other video chat program. When you first go live you'll introduce yourself to the guru and they'll do the same. They'll sound upbeat and motivated, but this only lasts through rapport phase. They'll ask you where you're from and talk about the weather. It's small talk for just a moment. This is building rapport. Rapport means getting in sync with you.

Once they feel you're comfortable, they start to take control.

Before moving into discovery phase, the guru takes a more serious tone. His voice lowers, and draws back from the excited pitch he held just moments ago. Then he/she sets the frame for the call with something like this:

"Just to recap, the purpose of today's call. We're going to go over your situation and I'm going to help you discover the exact steps you need to take to grow your business to six figures per month. After that, if we both agree on your course of action, and that you're a fit for our services, we may invite you to work with us as one of the students we'll accept this month into our program."

Though it sounds like they'll give you step-by-step instructions to 6-figures, that's not true. This statement really just tells you they're going to show you why you need their mentoring and at the end of the call they're going to try to sell you their system. Notice there's a lot of future pacing going on (pacing the the future that's soon to come, as well as potential distant futures).

At this point you can either disagree and end the call immediately and waste no more of their time...or you agree and you've unknowingly overcome many of your own objections before they were ever objections.


PHASE 2 - DISCOVERY

Discovery is the biggest, longest part of the call. In this phase the guru asks questions about your business and life. As you move forward, the questions get more and more targeted. They get harder to answer. They get more painful to think about.

This is called agitating your pain points.

Remember, people are highly motivated by pain. Until it becomes more painful to stay in place than to keep their hard earned cash, a prospect won't buy. So they have to feel the pain before the guru pitches the sale.

Now that you're in rapport, the guru leads into phase 2 with a question or statement like...

"So, what's the biggest problem in your business right now?"

or

"So, tell me about your business."

They start with a question or statement that leads into a BIG PICTURE open-ended response. They ask a question, then stop talking. That's when you tell them what's wrong with your business from your perspective. By the way, in order for you to recall this problem, you have to see it in your mind. That means you have to go to your internal world to find that information.

In other words, you go into a trance.
Trance occurs anytime your attention is focused inward.

Moving on...

Usually the guru already knows what you're going to say because you told them what you think is the problem on your application. So you might say something like:

YOU - "My business is doing okay...I just can't seem to get it fully off the ground.

People will say a lot more than that, but this is a quick example. Notice how the way you described your situation is vague. It's high level. It's big picture. Big picture isn't painful. So the guru has to probe deeper and get you more specific about your problem. To do that, they'll ask more targeted questions.

THEM - Why do you think that is?

YOU - Well, I'm not getting enough customers. I don't know how to get them.

THEM - How have you tried getting customers in the past?

YOU - I post on craigslist and share posts with my Facebook friends.

THEM - And how has that worked out for you?

YOU - Not very well. I had a few customers but they were mostly family.

THEM - Have you ever tried automating your process with ads?

YOU - I spent a little money on Facebook ads once but it didn't work very well.

THEM - How much did you spend on Facebook ads?

YOU - About $100 dollars.

THEM - And how many clients did you get?

YOU - None.

THEM - So how are you making money right now?

YOU - Well, I'm not making that much because I don't have that many customers.

THEM - How many sales do you make each month?

YOU - I'd say around 1 to 2.

THEM - How many sales have you made in the past month?

YOU - None.

THEM - And the month before that?

YOU - None.

THEM - And the month before that?

YOU - None.

THEM - So you're not making any money. How exactly is not having any clients for 3 months affecting your business?

YOU - It's getting really hard to keep going because I feel like I'm not making any progress. I'm not making much money and I don't know how long I can go on like this. I'm starting to put expenses on credit and burning through my savings.

THEM - And what about your family life? How does not being able to pay yourself affect your life at home?

YOU - Well, my wife gets upset with me because she has to cover all our bills. We've been fighting a lot lately. Our marriage is starting to suffer, and I hate that my daughter has to see that.

THEM - What do you think will happen if this keeps up?

YOU - Soon we'll run out of savings. We won't be able to afford our home. We'll get behind on our bills and be living on credit. I won't be able to provide clothes or food for my family and I...and I...and I...just don't know. I just don't know how I'll.....................I just don't know what to............................................................................


At this point you break down in F*cking tears. Your world goes dark. You've just been on a trip through the rabbit hole and...

...there's no happy ending. There can't be. If there were, the guru couldn't get you to open up your wallet. So they use leading questions to guide you through an imaginary tale that ends in the worst possible place.

Confronted with this reality, many people break down and cry.

Now that you're emotionally vulnerable, and experiencing this deep pain, you're wide open to be sold to. Not only that, you believe the guru has the solution to your problem. Why? Because how the hell else would he know such specific questions to ask? How could he know your pain so well if he wasn't an expert?

Simple...

You told him everything he needed to know long before you got on that call. He didn't bring any of this stuff to your attention. He just asked questions. You brought it to your own attention. Pulled it straight out of the deepest, darkest, pits of your own inner mind.


PHASE 3 - QUALIFYING

By this point the guru has probably decided if he can get your cash. This section doesn't take long. It's usually a series of 1-5 questions designed to make sure you're ready to go all-in.

Transitioning into this stage usually sounds like this:

THEM - Jim, based on everything you just told me, your business needs an automated system to generate a steady flow of clients month to month, but right now you're not making any sales. If you don't solve this problem, you're going to have some really bad financial problems, you won't be able to feed little Kimmy, and you'll probably destroy your marriage and live on the streets. Does that about sum it up?

YOU - *through sobs* Yes.

THEM - So let me ask you this...if there were a solution, would you be ready to invest in it?

YOU - Yeah, I mean I think so...

THEM - And knowing I've dealt with similar situations, would you agree I can help you?

YOU - Yeah, I think so.

THEM - You sound like you want to be a great father and husband, but are you ready to do the work required to create this profound change in your life?

YOU - Yeah, I just need a little help figuring out what to do.

THEM - Alright Jim, so here's how I can help you...when you work with me you'll be part of a powerful community of entrepreneurs headed toward success. You'll get access to our proven method of generating new clients automatically, and you'll get the best training money can buy, and I'll basically hold your hand every step of the way. Does that make sense for you?

YOU - Yeah, I guess so.


Now that I'm writing all this stuff down, this is kind of like the process police interrogators sometimes use that results in false confessions by innocent people.


PHASE 4 - CLOSING

Closing is where the guru pitches the sale. It's also the point you're most likely to object. The thing is, mentally you're broken. You feel vulnerable. You just want a solution. Your objections are weak at best, and most of them were already overcome.

You just don't know it yet.

THEM - Great, well Jim, I can help you change your situation. I can help you set up systems that help you generate a consistent flow of high-paying clients so you have steady income at higher rates than ever before, and put you on track for 6-figures in the next six months. Sound good?



[Their tone usually rises at this point. They want you to associate them with positive feelings now that we're close to the sale.]



YOU - *smiling and a happy small chuckle* That sounds great.

THEM - Great! So, to change your life, and get your business back on track, and to make sure your family is fed, clothed, and can start living a better life, and to put you on track toward your first 6 or 7-figures...... it's just $10,000. Will that be Visa or Mastercard?


OBJECTIONS

Bitch slapped with an insane number, your eyes go wide. Is this guy nuts? But the guru doesn't flinch. You won't hear the slightest waivering at all. The guru knows all he has to do is act like he doesn't care if you buy or not.

Why?

Because of confidence. If the guru sounds like he doesn't care if you buy, it tells you that he must be the real deal because someone who was full of shit would beg for your cash. So the guru keeps his cool. He pretends to be a doctor, and you're the patient, and if you don't want his help, no problem. He'll try to get you to see how this cancer is going to kill you, but ultimately, you have to decide to let him operate.

YOU - Oh, uh, I didn't expect it to be so much.

THEM - *Silence*

YOU - I don't think I can come up with that.

THEM - What do you think stops you right now?

YOU - It's just a lot of money and I'm not making very much.

THEM - That's exactly why you need our help, Jim.

YOU - Yeah, but I just think I want to try it on my own first.

THEM - I understand Jim, but where has that gotten you so far?

YOU - Good point...well, I need to talk to my wife first.

THEM - I understand Jim, but does your wife make these decisions for you?

YOU - No...but I just don't know how I can pay.
(you've moved from "NO" to "how"...)

THEM - A lot of our customers put their payment on credit. Which major credit cards do you use?

YOU - Well, I guess I could maybe do it from my VISA card, but my limit is $2000.

THEM - That's fine, we have a flexible payment option so it's just 6 monthly installments of $2,000. You could do the first $2,000 now and pay down that amount or ask for a limit increase later if you need to. Go ahead with the card number whenever you're ready.


Basically any objection you might have, they have a solution for. They overcome your objections through any means, but usually it's not that hard because you're on a live call, and you already told them everything they need to know to overcome your objections. In reality, you overcame your own objections, and that's why it works so well.

And this...my friends...is how a free webinar turns into a $10,000 sale.

Title makes sense now, eh?

If you make 'em cry, they'll buy.

That's it for today. In the next lesson we'll cover what happens after you buy. Lots of fun tidbits still to come, but we'll save that for later.

See you soon.



P.S.

Notice this entire system is based on the guru asking YOU questions. That's because when they ask questions, you must respond. They don't want to be the one responding to questions. Questions reveal things, as you've clearly seen. Who knows what your questions could reveal if you started asking...

 

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[Lex DeVille]

Excellent post Lex.

When you get time can you break down what you think are legit ways for a good course to advertise and market themselves.

When we get into the intricacies of the cult elements (there's a reason I used that word in the title) some of the more underhanded tactics will come to light. But in general the big picture system works and is legit for most marketers.

The funnel system, whether it starts with a FB ad, YouTube video or something else is not the problem. The problem is what happens in the funnel. What's said, implied, triggered, etc.

I don't think you're using FB funnels right now, but the legit way to market is pretty much how you already do it. Value first (real value, not perceived or implied value). Connecting with your audience and engaging them. Answering questions. Being available when possible, and letting your people give you permission to share more with them.

It's not wrong to have a group, or use retargeting ads, or speak to your target's pain points. What's wrong is not having a product that legitimately solves or attempts to solve those pain points once that person goes all-in with you.

Edit - did you give away all your rep points?

Ya, it was a sort of reset with the forum. Don't want all my rep based on posts I made like 3 or 4 years ago. Want to bring relevant value now.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

(MOVED OUTSIDE PER YOUR REQUEST)

Great stuff Lex, the "closed loop" of story telling alone is worth a NOTABLE tag.

The guru scam (lotta bro-marketing and gurus teaching you how to be a guru) is a complicated version of the envelope stuffing scam from the 70's and 80's, widely advertised in classified ads and newspapers.

Send me $1 to this post office box and I'll show you how to make $1 for every envelope you stuff!

After you send the $1 to the mailbox, you get a return envelope that says, "Ha sucker, just repeat what I did."

 

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[Kane9]

This is pretty much how webinars go. I can't wait to get into that topic after the landing pages. The marketers tell the Tier 2 gurus to do the webinar live until they create one that resonates with their audience. Then automate it and make it look live.

Most of the Tier 2 gurus follow this, but the Tier 3 gurus don't because they're afraid of being exposed if they go live. Instead, they just record a webinar and try to automate it without much testing. It ends up being a huge flop most of the time. But webinars that were tested and proven...those webinars work, and even when they're automated they get people to buy.

The reason gurus use Facebook is because it works.

I wouldn't say it's about the people who click not valuing their time, though. I also wouldn't say it's about separating the streetsmart from the gullible. Facebook simply gets you in front of people with really specific targeting. Google can work for this purpose too as long as the marketing communications are on point, but that's not what the Tier 1 gurus preach.

When you look at how cults recruit, they don't look for the gullible. They don't go after the mentally challenged. They target streetsmart, educated individuals because those people believe they won't be duped into a cult.

That actually makes them among the easiest to recruit and most likely to fall victim to a cult!

Funny thing is, once indoctrinated, those same individuals become the most valuable, dedicated cult contributors, especially once they've identified with the cult membership and group think takes over.

It's funny, because around a month ago, I decided to go through a marketing funnel as research. The promotion of this webinar was quite impressive and had been promoted by other marketers whose email lists I signed up to as research.

I knew I didn't want the product when I decided to enter the funnel. I just wanted to study the funnel. Marketing porn, I guess.

So eventually I begin watching their webinar. All along, I'm making mental notes, raising a wry smile whenever I noticed what they were up to.

There I was, sat watching this webinar as "the street smart, educated individual that knew I wouldn't be duped."

But time started to get on, and I had other stuff I needed to do. So I quit watching, right?

Nope. Subconsciously, there were open loops that needed answering.

Towards the end of the webinar, when the social proof was being added, the scarcity elements were being thrown in etc. Something f*cked up happened.

I noticed that my mind had wandered off and was figuring whether I could pay for this product.

That says it all. On a conscious level, I had no intention of purchasing this product. But they had hit enough psychological triggers that a deep part of me needed what they were offering.

It was an interesting learning experience. When I'm writing copy, I include these elements, but because I'm the crafting the message, it's hard to imagine how powerful they are. It's a kind of... produce what you've learned and trust the process kind of thing. But man, that was an eye opener.

 

[Lex DeVille]

GURU LANDING PAGES ARE SHORT AND SWEET
​

Most guru ads lead to a landing page with an opt-in of some sort (usually for a webinar). The landing page doesn't seem like a page of influence, but it is. We won't spend much time on it because there's not much to cover, but there are a few key things to point out.

LANDING PAGE TITLE

I forgot to cover this on the Facebook ad part, but guru landing pages use the same title as the ad headline. Their titles target very specific people with very specific needs and overcome their objections at the same time.

This isn't an ad funnel landing page, but it's still a good example. It starts with how simple it is to make a million dollar coaching business. How they did it with just ONE 45-Minute Presentation. Notice they avoid calling it a webinar, because that's kind of a taboo word now.

The headline makes it sound super easy, shows you get something for free, and targets people who want to build a million dollar plus coaching business.

Their subheadline addresses any limiting beliefs the prospect might have that stop them from moving forward. They're saying they did this without a blog, podcast, YouTube, or ANY boring marketing stuff no one wants to do... What they're implying is you can do this without a blog, podcast, YouTube, or ANY BORING PROCESS because who has time for that...

This title will be the headline for their ad, their landing page, their webinar, and will probably be on their sales pages and other marketing communications. The formulas are pretty simple...

How To Do X (great thing)
Without Y (all the bad things)

How To Do X (great thing)
Without Y (bad thing)
Even If (all the reasons that stop you right now)

For instance, one of my past programs used something like:

How To Become A Great Copywriter
(even if you suck at writing and failed English twice)

The top part describes what this is (copywriter training), who it's for (people who want to learn to write copy), and states an outcome without making guarantees. The subheadline uses things people think to themselves (limiting beliefs) to enhance the headline and overcome their doubts.

THE BULLET POINTS

The next thing you'll usually find on these landing pages is a series of bullet points. These bullets simply describe the pain you have and show how that will transform once you go through the webinar.

When you make the shifts you will...

• Have what you need to generate a steady flow of high-pay clients
(even if you don't have any clients right now.)
• Know the secret to growing a loyal following
(even if you don't have any social followers or an email list right now)
• Know how to put yourself on track toward your first 5, or 6 figures
(even if you don't currently believe it is possible right now)
• Discover how to live a life of passion and joy while doing what you love
(without spending years wandering in circles wondering why people won't buy)

These bullets will be very specific to the ideal client, their problems, and their limiting beliefs. They use a similar formula as the title to draw you in, remind you why you're there an what you get, and show you how you, yes, even you, can make this happen!

THE COUNTDOWN TO WEBINAR LAUNCH

Most landing pages have a countdown to webinar launch. A lot of gurus launch several days from the date of signup, but one thing I learned from the top guys is they say they use a system like Stealth Seminar.

Stealth Seminar not only automates webinars, but their countdown timer makes it appear as though the webinar is launching at the top of the hour. That makes it seem like you're just in time...you just barely made it. Lucky you!

Gurus claim this increases webinar conversions by like 90% and people are far more likely to watch the full webinar. What's funny is I notice some of them don't use this system despite teaching it. So I suspect it's mainly another affiliate income source that generates a hefty profit considering Stealth Seminar starts at like $70 a month.

CREDIBILITY MARKERS

If they didn't post credibility markers in their FB ads, they usually will here. Just a little bit. It will either be a testimonial of someone who "closed two $5,000 sales their first week" or logos of the places they've been featured like Entrepreneur.com, Forbes etc. These are usually directly below the bullet points.

LIMITED TIME OFFER

This is the landing page most high-ticket gurus are taught to use. The top guys and girls aren't using it, but it's what they've taught in the past. Usually there's a notice at the bottom that says something like:

"We have 75 seats available and they go fast so join now!

It's part of the template, but they usually modify it a little.

CALL TO ACTION

There's usually 2 calls to action. The rest of the landing page is pretty standard. Not much info beyond the bullets. Just enough to agitate your pain and give you enough reasons to enroll right now.

 

[Smith11B]

Man, this is spot on. I worked for one of the largest of these guys as a facebook ads manager and copywriter. (A tier one guy for sure. NDA so I won't disclose.) but this is the exact method save one thing in the discovery call I think is super important.

The Silence.

They don't teach to go for the kill with the credit card anymore. Instead, they use silence. After the guru says:

Great, well Jim, I can help you change your situation. I can help you set up systems that help you generate a consistent flow of high-paying clients so you have steady income at higher rates than ever before, and put you on track for 6-figures in the next six months. Sound good?

You: Yes I think so.

Then Silence.

Hey may say "cool" or something like that. But after that it's silence.

Why?

Because the only logical thing you can do is ask him what the price is. You already know he is not going to help you for free. He preemptively told you this when he said If you're a fit we'll extend an offer and accept you into the program. You also just admitted to both him and yourself that you need help and you think he can help you. There is a bit of social pressure for you to not be a hypocrite now. So..

You: What's it cost to work with you?

Guru: What do you mean? and then Silence.

Why?

Because he want's you to describe what you think you're getting out of the deal for two reasons. The first is so he can find any gaps between what you think he offers and what he offers. He wants to reframe it if you have it differently in your mind. The second is so you cement the benefit in your own head, there a little power in speaking it into existence and acting on it.

You: What's it cost to have you help me get systems etc etc....

Guru: As if he barely heard you. Oh It's just $10,000.

Silence.

Most salesman are uncomfortable here but the guru is not. Most salesman if you don't say anything will start filling the silence, explaining how they can lower the price or how they know it's too high etc. Not the guru. He's want's you to give your true objection so he can crush that and not your knee jerk reaction.

The guru I worked for called this entire process leaning out for the close. And most of the people he coached of course followed it without knowing the psychology behind it. It works

 

[Lex DeVille]

@SinisterLex you mentioned Tier 1, 2 and 3 gurus in your posts. Could you elaborate on the tiers (eg in terms of how they work their charm, their competency level and actual value of their products/services)? Based on what I've read so far is it correct to say that Tier 1 gurus are the real thing, tier 2 gurus may or may not be the real thing (depend on their area of expertise), and tier 3 gurus are just starting out / pure BRO-marketers?

By the way have you come across any Tier 1 guru? I'm just curious to see how you view them and the way they do their marketing. Thanks!

Tier 1 - This would be the digital marketing companies or marketers at the top who spend hundreds of thousands learning what works to sell their marketing system to coaches, coursemakers etc. Neil Patel, and Derek Halpern are two of the more well-known names, but the best example is probably Russ Ruffino's Clients on Demand. The other day in his Facebook group he mentioned their business hit their first million dollar month recently. This group also includes the biggest, most notable coaches, speakers etc. Tony Robbins, Ramit Sethi, and other names you'd know if you heard them. These are influencers others model their systems after.

Tier 2 - At this level you've got gurus who have money to spend on high-ticket training. They're not as well known and you probably haven't heard of them, but they're still training with the big dogs at the top and earning hundreds of thousands, if not millions per year. They spend money on all the retreats and enroll in the most expensive courses and trainings to learn how to sell their coaching programs better. These gurus will buy virtually anything if it will help them sell. The biggest one I worked with directly sells a repackaged version of Clients on Demand system. It's almost exactly the same with a hint of "branding" sprinkled in. Some of the gurus at this level do sell really valuable programs, but you're gonna pay for them.

Tier 3 - This level is made up mostly of people who buy into Tier 2 programs. Tier 2 programs are usually less expensive than Tier 1 programs, (but not always). Unlike Tier 1 and Tier 2, Tier 3 people often have little to no business experience. They're looking for the fast path out of the 9-5, and they believe coaching is the way. Since Tier 2 teaches them to do what they love and use their system to sell it, they end up not making much money, because what they sell isn't worth the $3000-$5000 price tag they slap on it. These people take out loans to buy the training, and they'll buy multiple trainings because they suffer a lot from imposter syndrome. In Tier 3 you find gurus selling more abstract concepts like "life" "inspirational" "spiritual" or "motivation" coaching, because these are concepts where it's hard to measure success, and easy to say someone didn't do it right if it doesn't work.

Tier 4 - This would probably be the final tier. This is the tier a certain recently outed guru around here would fall into. They follow people like Neil Patel or Tony Robbins and try to reverse engineer their systems so they don't have to pay for any training. They might pay for less expensive training such as NLP where they don't have to put much of their own money at risk because they don't have much to spend. This tier includes a lot of ebook wantrepreneurs who sell shit they don't even practice. They sell mostly low cost programs because they don't know anything about selling high-ticket programs, and they have limiting beliefs about others buying from them in the first place. As someone previously mentioned, it's much safer to sell an ebook at $2.99 than a program at $10,000 when what you're selling is crap. If someone refunds $2.99, it's no big deal. But at $10k, that's gonna make a dent. Tier 4 gurus mostly get their info from blogs, emails, books and low-cost gurus at the bottom.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

Subscribed!

Lex, do u recommend that for those of us selling products via e-commerce, use the concepts behind this sort of sales method? I'm reading this book called Cashvertising and it seems to use a similar type of copywriting to these guru cults (but not as extreme it seems).

I must say I find it eerie and disturbing how these guru cults can manipulate the human mind to such a deep level. It's pure genius.

Nowadays I just scroll past these sort of ads on FB but judging by the amt of comments and likes, they seem very popular.

Yes, and no. It depends on what you're selling and how you intend to sell it. The ecom brand I'm working now will focus heavy on storytelling and metaphors, but not for the same reasons a guru would. Also, I won't be drawing people into any webinars to sell my ecommerce products.

The techniques in Ca$hvertising are useful for selling ecom products, and they're used by virtually every guru on the planet. It's how they're applied that is slightly different, but there are a lot of similarities, such as the Lifeforce 8. The underlying psychology remains the same, but is applied differently based on the product and what the audience needs from it.

For instance, a lot of people read Ca$hvertising and a few other bits of copywriting and think they should center align their text on the website, and give people commands to "act now!" But often those techniques fall flat when it's not what the audience needs from the writing.

If I sell a "calming bath soap" my customers will want every word of what I write to be about calming, soothing, natural, refreshing, relaxing. If I use direct response tactics like center aligning my text (which isn't a calming and natural way to read) and buttons that say "Buy Now!" (which is in your face) it won't suddenly compel them to buy.

So this is a matter of applying the appropriate styles and techniques based on what the customer needs to make the decision to move forward.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

WTF, this thread is forcing me to think of another TAG beyond GOLD... platinum? Legendary? Mind blown?



More thanks and rep+

 

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[MJ DeMarco]

For those who may not understand the concept of a productocracy VS bro-marketing...

A hammer can help you build a house, something quite valuable.
A hammer can also be used to threaten (or coerce) you into giving someone money for something not so valuable.

The tool is the same.

How it used, is not.

 

[Smith11B]

Just reading your post made me uncomfortable. Man oh man.

Great insights

The stuff is scary powerful man. If you cannot deliver you can really ruin someones life. But there's a deeper part of it even.

The true secret to high ticket is in being able to articulate the problem better than anyone else and direct it onto one of the LF8. This is what the gurus study along with the cult stuff and is the real key. This is also the reason why niches work, but most people don't understand it.

The LF8 are 8 desires you are born with and really can't shake. I won't go into detail on them here but you'll find them in the book Ca$hvertising.

Here's why it's so powerful.

Let's say you are a gym coach or online personal trainer or whatever.

Most people understand that you have to talk about problems and pain to market to someone well. So most pin point pains like this:

"You don't like how you look"
"You can't look in the mirror"
"Not being able to go to the beach sucks"
"Picking things up and losing your breath sucks"
"Not being able to play sports with your friends sucks"
"You can get diabetes."
"You're at risk for heart attack"

These are legit pains right? They hurt a lot. So they craft their message around them.

Here's how a high level gurus selling high ticket personal training would do it.

"You don't understand. That feeling that you feel? That lack of confidence in getting naked? That lack of pride in yourself when its time to hit the beach? Its so pervasive and has you so ashamed that you shy away from showing up in a sexual way with your wife. Instead you turn to porn and it's leaving a rift in your marriage. This has lead to a lack of connection and its probably to the point where shes thought more than once about more attractive men, or worse, ending the marriage entirely. Completely destroying your family. Your child's life altered. Your own life altered and headed down a dark path. All because you couldn't get your body together."

Now.. notice how the problem shifted from "I want to get in shape" to "I want to keep my family intact and give my wife the love she deserves." What is the latter worth? It's priceless. And so you take out your wallet.

If you can get this right, persuasion becomes easy. The close after that is just a precaution.

This is the power of a good copywriter like @SinisterLex (or myself if I can toot my own horn.)

It's also why Gurus are so dangerous, and why they make boatloads of cash.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

Thanks for creating this thread @SinisterLex. What do you think of Darren Hardy? His Darren Daily video does have high production value and can sometimes be inspiring. I do feel that he is a very competent story teller and marketer. Only thing is his contents felt kind of "fluffy" and they don't leave very lasting impact. When he starts to promote his courses he can be very aggressive and persuasive. However when you see enough marketing tactics you kind of have a hunch that something's not quite right (just not able to tell what it is).

I'm not familiar with Darren Hardy, but he has the look of a Tier 2 Guru. Some things I notice at a quick glance:

• His programs look like they cover abstract concepts (things that can't really be measured)
• A lot of testimonials that don't mention SPECIFIC results (the training had a big impact on my life is incredibly vague)
• He's probably a good speaker and strong communicator and is good with storytelling
• Looks like he has good funnels in place that are pretty well fleshed out
• Targets a variety of industries which is a bit of a red flag for me

Based on all of this, I wouldn't buy from him. Others might find value in his NLP-based motivational speeches, but I wonder how much they take away at the end of the day.

(Note: this is kind of what Tony Robbins does also. I don't usually buy from him, but I'm not just starting out. I have some of his books, but not his training. The amount of value I might get from Tony would probably be different from what a brand new entrepreneur would get.)

 

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[Lex DeVille]

This post to me feels like an exorcist has arrived to purge the demons. It's a much-needed breath of fresh air to purge the bad Guru Juju from our midst. Your timing on this post was impeccable and the content is excellent. What a wonderful restorative helpful thread. Excellent post. Speed+

There is something deliciously restorative for the Forum right now about an anti Guru coming in here with actual first-hand experience. No wonder this thread was moved to gold within 24 hours of its posting.

Would you still find it refreshing if you knew it was by design?

There's a reason this thread happened now instead of several weeks ago, though I blocked a certain guru around 6 months ago.

Robert Cialdini describes it as the privileged moment.

It's an influence enhancer.
(a "presuasion" tactic)

While I couldn't possibly know for sure if the thread would go gold, I could be reasonably confident due to recent focused attention on negative gurus opening a privileged moment in which the forum would be receptive to my words.

Another guru tactic.

It demonstrates how it doesn't matter if someone is gullible or not. Streetsmart or not. The tactics and techniques can and do work when the marketer or guru (or cult leader!) knows what they're doing.

Some gurus aren't very good at it. But that makes those who are, that much more devious and hard to spot.

You might have to change your sn to ExorcistLex.

Ha! After the part above, you might think me the devil himself!

 

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[Lex DeVille]

THE LINK BETWEEN DANGEROUS CULT
RECRUITMENT & MODERN GURU TACTICS


​

Modern guru marketing is a clone of classic cult recruitment.

Though new outreach tools (like social media bots) exist, and traditional entry points vary (seminars vs webinars etc.) the psychological tactics, and general approach is nearly identical.

By the way, the process is also virtually identical for MLM recruitment.

Here's how it goes:



STAGE 1 - TARGET THE MIDDLE, NOT THE BOTTOM

When the light turns green, you drive. You don't look left because you have a green light. You have the right of way. Therefore, why worry about that '98 Dodge Dakota carrying that late-for-work driver who hit the gas instead of the breaks to catch the light?

What I'm saying is, your guard is down. And because it's down, you're vulnerable. So you don't wait that extra second to avoid becoming a breaking news story for channel 5.

Everybody thinks they'd never fall prey to a dangerous cult.

That's exactly why they do.

You believe only psychos or the mentally unstable would join a dangerous cult. But why would a cult want mentally unstable members? How many psychos do you know who are doing big things in life? Not many. It's hard enough with your head on straight.

So cults target the middle, not the bottom.

They aim for the vulnerable. Intelligent individuals. People with a degree. People without a degree. People who think outside of the box. People who conform. People who don't conform. People with money or skills. People others follow. People who all believe they'd never get sucked up into a [cult, guru funnel, MLM]. These are the easiest people to convince to join a cult.

The cult gets to know these people extremely well [target marketing].

Then it puts its feelers out.

Traditional cults recruit through direct contact just like MLMs do. An individual finds others and invites them to [read this book, join this seminar, watch this video, take this course] after all, it's free!

Guru marketing systems use Facebook or other paid ads to get in front of you. They use SEO targeted blog posts that hint at solutions to pains you search for. They form Facebook groups or get you to sign up for email lists based on specific criteria designed to weed out psychos, and pull in vulnerable, valuable, potential contributors.

Then they invite you to their free [webinar, ebook, blog post, video training, masterclass].





STAGE 2 - CONTROL WHAT THEY KNOW (AND WHEN AND WHERE THEY GO)

There's no harm attending a free [insert whatever] or so you think.

You are wrong.

Cults capitalize on what Robert Cialdini defines as a privileged moment -- a moment when they have your undivided attention. During the seminar, the information flow is FROM the speaker TO you.

This is not an open discussion.

They control the information you receive.

Why?

Because by controlling information, they can influence how you think, feel, and even how you behave. This is a process of mind control.

Not only do they control the flow of information, they control WHAT information is shared. That means they set the context and frame for whatever is being discussed. By doing this, they can say exactly what you need to hear and avoid probing questions that might reveal red flag truths.

If you're on a webinar, you'll be asked to put away cell phones, and close out of other browsers. You'll be asked to make sure you are free from all outside distractions. Whether it's a cult or guru marketing, both aim to take advantage of this privileged moment when they have your focused attention.

For those who don't know, focused attention is how you induce trance.

This probably happens to you every time you buy groceries with a credit card. You put the card in the slot and wait to punch in your PIN. Your attention is focused on the the machine. If a sinister cashier (not saying I've tried this, just sayin' ..........) interrupts your focus, you will go into a trance.

If said cashier then suggests how delicious a conveniently placed dark chocolate bar might taste with that conveniently placed creamy peanut butter over there...there's a good chance you'd imagine how tasty it would be, right before you go ahead and add both to your bill.

Cults purposely use seminars because it's easy to eliminate outside distractions. Plus they control your behavior by telling you to hold bathroom breaks and questions until the end (by which time you've probably forgotten about both). After that, the speaker gets to work. He uses trance induction techniques ranging from open loops and vague language to long, boring speeches with confusing stories and talk of transformation.

On a webinar you eliminate distractions on your own. You probably wear headphones. You might take notes. While you write, the guru talks and talks and talks and says exactly what you want to hear. They never reveal the goods, but they give you just enough to keep you wanting more. The entire process takes about an hour. That's an hour of filling you with every kind of psychological manipulation tactic in their tool box.

In the most advanced cult and guru funnels, EVERYTHING is carefully considered and controlled.

• Font size and positioning
• Webinar background images and their intended effect based on the words being spoken
• Copywriting
• Slide presentation order
• Vocal speed, pitch, and tonality
• Body language (if the guru is visible)
• Psychological Triggers
• How to present credibility in the most effective way
• Liking, scarcity, reciprocation & concessions, consistency, social proof
• Pre-suasion techniques
• Neuro-linguistic programming and hypnotherapy
• Emotional highs and lows

During this free event, something strange happens. You don't know why or how, but eventually you start to feel:

1) Like the guru is making some kind of sense (he must be because other people seem to agree)

2) Like you are someone leading a life of lies and there's certain changes (read "shifts") you need to make.

The combined group-think social techniques and guilt and/or shame tactics are enough to move you forward to stage 3 of your recruitment.





STAGE 3 - INVITE 'EM TO THE AFTER PARTY, IT'S FREE!

By the end of the free event, you WILL be invited to go deeper...

Cults often invite members to some kind of weekend or week long party or advanced seminar. Gurus and MLMs invite you to speak with them privately to "find out if they can help you."

Both seek to isolate you from other people who haven't just spent the last hour or 10 in a controlled trance, for obvious reasons...because those people would tell you to...

...GET THE F*CK OUT!!!!!!

But when you reach this point, you've already pre-qualified yourself as a cult member, and you've invested quite a bit of your time. Plus there's always that chance these guys "are the real deal."

So you again you think, what can it hurt?

Dangerous cults will say anything to get you away from other people and alone with them. Gurus will IMPLY anything to get you alone with them. If you go forward after that, there's a VERY STRONG CHANCE you will become a cult member regardless of how aware you may be.

Once you're alone, (or on the phone for a discovery call) they move in for the kill...ahem...sale.

We talked about that previously, so let's continue...





STEP 4 - ONCE YOU GOT 'EM...KEEP 'EM

If you go away for the weekend with a cult, you probably won't come back anytime soon (maybe ever). While you're away, you're still in the honeymoon phase. Forgot to mention that earlier...

Until you're officially a cult member, and even for a short period afterward, you'll be praised and showered with love by other members who want you to join. They'll talk about how great their life is and how freeing it is. They'll continuously tell you all the things you want to hear.

Beach Body "personal trainers" on Instagram do this all day long. They talk about what "great things" becoming a Beach Body Coach has done for them. They focus on their fitness, and on how tasty Shakeology is. They imply they travel a lot and lead extraordinary lives (think Tai Lopez tactics). Then they talk about all the people in the "6 Figure Club" -- and even though they aren't there yet, they're on their way!

Beach Body is an MLM...

It operates like a cult, and coaches are constantly recruiting all day every day.

#BEACEO
#OWNYOUROWNBUSINESS
#WORKFROMHOME

Cults use praise to pump you up and motivate you, despite how tired you are from everything you've been through up to this point. It's not unlike how car dealerships keep you on the lot as long as possible to wear you down for an easy sell. Once you're alone with a cult, the entire world focuses on keeping you there. At first through praise, then through guilt, shame and ultimatums (we'll talk about that in a minute).

Gurus invite you into their inner circle, inner Facebook group, "Triple Platinum Alliance" or whatever. There you meat other group members who praise you for making the decision to join, and welcome you to the inside. Once you're in, you get to relax a little despite the $10,000 you just put on credit. At least you're around other people who did the same, and it seems things worked out for them! Whew...you might be okay after all...

(by the way I meant to use "meat" instead of "meet" in that last paragraph because you are "fresh meat" once you step inside)

As fresh meat you have to learn the ropes. Cults don't want to scare you off so they wrap praise guilt and shame together in a nice little package until you learn the "right" way.

If you do something that doesn't fit cult norms, they'll say or do things that make you feel shameful, while playing it off as a little thing. For instance, if you wear your shoes in the house, another member might giggle and say, "What are you stupid? We don't wear shoes inside because it represents the repression of our natural affinities by capitalist pigs over the last 10,000 years.

Since you're still a new member, you're unenlightened, therefore you don't understand what the f*ck they just said, and can't possibly interpret it. And it doesn't make you think they're nuts, it makes you feel like you're too stupid and unenlightened to know what they mean at this point, so you just accept it while feeling shamed.

In Guru cults the same thing happens. Current members will guide you and if you step out of line, they'll chastise you. They'll make you feel stupid or unenlightened in much the same way. At the same time, they're teaching you how to behave the right way....their way.

In dangerous cults it gets much worse later on. The longer you're with the cult, the harsher the guilt and shaming can be. You'll be expected to do things, for instance recruiting, and if you fail or choose not to help, you'll be made to feel like a terrible person until you give in.

If at any time you consider leaving the cult, you'll also be made aware that if you leave, you can NEVER return. In spiritual cults this indicates you can NEVER be one of "God's children" or whatever deity they worship. It also indicates you will suffer eternal damnation for your choice to leave. This creates an impossible dilemma!

Since the cult obviously has your best interests at heart...they must go to any lengths to stop you from leaving, because that's how they save you. This can be spun in many other ways, but it always comes down to an ultimatum. If you leave, you're cast out for good. As a "brother" or "sister" of theirs, the other members cannot allow that to happen.

Guru cults sometimes use a similar tactic in which if you leave the group, or ask for a refund, you may NEVER be invited back or allowed to join again. You may NEVER discover the secret to millions. You may NEVER achieve success because you need them. So you think long and hard before you leave.





STEP 6 - IDENTITY CHANGE COMPLETE -- WE ARE NEGAN!

From start to finish, everything up to this point has involved an identity change process.

In the beginning you were your own person. Curious. Naive maybe. Vulnerable. You just wanted to solve some problem you had. But over the course of a day or a week or maybe even years, the person you were was lost. At some point it was replaced by a new identity.

The military uses an incredibly similar process. It goes like this:

• Unfreeze
• Change
• Refreeze

1) UNFREEZE
Before you adapt a new identity, you first must release the old one. Thus, the guru's 5-shifts webinar and all of their marketing materials constantly promote the shifts you must make before you get what you want.

This is where mind control techniques come into play.

Remember earlier I said if you control information flow, you control how a person thinks, feels, and behaves. And in my last post I said if you control any one of those 3, you can influence the other 2. Now, here's a secret...if you control all of 3, you can unfreeze a person's identity.

So the military, and also cults, start by controlling your environment. In doing so, they control the information flow. You show up at basic training or at the cult center. Then they push you physically (pushups, running, flutter kicks or other labor tasks). You're always tired, so you're always just trying to make it a little further.

Your entire day is controlled. You have no time to yourself. You're yelled at. Shamed. Guilted. Eventually, you break down.

The U.S. Army (when I went through) called this "Red" phase. There's also a "White" and a "Blue" phase, which align with the "change" and "refreeze" parts of this process.

Gurus do this by getting you to put yourself in their webinar. From there they control the information flow. They also control your behavior by only guiding you down their funnel path. They also control the context and frame and therefore control how and what you think. In doing that they can also manipulate your feelings and emotions.

All of this leads to you unfreezing the person you are, in order to be open to becoming the person you'd like to be.


2) CHANGE
Now you've lost your identity. You are not who you were before. You don't know who you are yet, but you're not the old person. Life is not the same. Every second of your day is controlled. Everything is different and there's no turning back.

Your only choice is forward.

Here the military sends you through endless classes (cults send you through seminars, and gurus put you through their course). Some are outside where you learn to shoot, move and kill. Others are inside, where you watch boring a$$ powerpoints or videos or listen to instructors drone on in your half-awake, more asleep state.

(Gurus accomplish this through goal setting and other homework activities and instructing meditation that takes up your time.)

So now you're exhausted mentally and physically. You've been in a constant trance. Your entire world was flipped upside down, and now you just want to adapt and survive.

Therefore, you begin to accumulate a new way of thinking.

You start to pick up the military's way of doing things. You learn how cult members operate. You stop doing things that lead to negative outcomes and start adapting behaviors that get you treated well. During all of this, you are adapting a new way of life, their way.

What I'm saying is...who you are begins to change.



3) REFREEZE
In the final stage you receive your new identity. In the Army, this is a glorious ceremony in which you're awarded your new identity in front of a large spectator audience. You are no longer the pathetic, weak brokeass fool you were before. Today, you're a United States Soldier.

With a handshake, and a salute from a guy you barely know...your identity transformation is complete.

NOTE: None of this is to claim that military is a dangerous cult. Just stating parallels.

Cults often give people new names to complete their identity shift.

Gurus give their members fancy titles.

In any case, it doesn't matter what you're called. You are no longer who you were. Instead...

YOU ARE NEGAN!!!

From here on out you are EXTREMELY open to whatever the group, cult, or guru desires.

You've committed too much. Invested too much. Altered your identity. To go against this path would be to turn against yourself. To quit would be to quit yourself. To not invest $30,000 for the super inner platinum millionaire alliance retreat special seminar, would be to fail yourself, the group members, and the leader.

So you just continue forward...because that's all you can do.

And this, my friends, is where we end for today, but you're invited to come party at my shack in the middle of nowhere all next week with me and a small group of friends if you want...

It's free...

 

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[AllenCrawley]

Thanks for posting this! So happy you're able to articulate something here on the forum that has been woefully needed. The parallels here and the recent Andrew fiasco are painfully obvious but I'm sure there are some that will continue defending him.

Folks, it is vitally important to hone your BS meter. What Lex is laying out here is gold.

Rep+

 

[Andy Black]

I worked with an affiliate marketer last year doing some AdWords tests for him. He had a look at my marketplace ad and said "I can do some damage with that."

Me: "What do you mean?"

Him: "I could make that really hum for you. Hmmm... the title should be something like "Discover the one secret that blah blah" "

Me: "Err, no thanks. When someone says they have a "secret" I instantly dismiss it as spam."



I hate all the cr@p out there. Go off TFLF and it's just a spam fest. Some Facebook groups are awful. LinkedIn news is full of really poor examples of "content marketing". Feck that.





My litmus test is whether I think Richard Branson, Elon Musk, MJ, Vigilante, etc would continue reading it.

They're business owners. If it's not going to appeal to them, then it's not a B2B play, and is therefore a B2C play.

(I'm not just starting out so this litmus test maybe isn't for people trying to get started?)

I wrote about it a bit here:

• This Secret CPA Method + Ninja Traffic Tactics = $1,000+/Weekly

The example in the opening post?

I wouldn't read past the third line normally. I read it all since you've put it up there as an example.

I think it's extremely well done - not a word out of place, and designed to separate their target from the crowd, and their cash from their wallets.

Am I throwing out the baby with the bathwater? Am I judging her course/programme based solely on her ad? Yeah... my alarm bells are going off. She's following a formula, and I don't trust it.



I’m subscribed and following this thread @SinisterLex.

I have a course that could probably do very well outside TFLF, but I can't bring myself to compete with the shysters out there. It makes my skin crawl.

I'll stick to building a DFY business.


EDIT: I'm tempted to relook at my own marketplace ad, but won't.

EDIT2: I couldn't help myself. I re-looked at my marketplace ad. I'm happy with it. Some slight leanings towards "copywriting", but not too much.

 

[Lex DeVille]

Lex, excellent write up. Powerful stuff. I’m looking forward to your next topic about landing pages.

—
Questions:

1. What process does the guru use to create a “client profile”? Are they using a software or collecting surveys?

2. What key words does a guru look for?

3. Is the AIDA formula the most effective?

4. What funnel version do you like best? Or does it depend on what’s being sold?

Most gurus have a questionnaire with a bunch of client profile fields:

• Gender:
• Age:
• Location
• Marital Status:
• Children:
• Industry:
• Hobbies:
• Hangouts:

The one I use, and shared with my past students has a lot of fields. Basically think of any element that might give you some insight into how the customer thinks about the problem they have, what the underlying problem might be, and what needs to happen to get them to take action to try and solve it.

• What is the problem?
• What problems does that cause?
• How does my customer experience the problem?
• What happens as a result of having that problem?
• How does having that problem make them feel?
• What happens if they don't solve that problem?
• What words and phrases does my customer use to describe the problem?

etc.

To get this information gurus use surveys, polls, ask their Facebook groups, read emails from students or non-students, or even sit down with their prospects and simply ask them questions. A lot of the key words and phrases come from complaints. People complaining about life.

How a prospect might describe a problem in a Facebook Group post:
"I've tried to get coaching clients for a year, but I feel like I'm stuck in mud spinning my wheels."

How the guru capitalizes on that information in their marketing materials:
"Are you struggling to get coaching clients? Have you tried to get clients for a year or more? Does it feel like you're stuck in mud spinning your wheels? If any of this sounds like you, then read this..."

AIDA is pretty much used in any marketing situation. You won't have desire without interest and you won't have interest without their attention, and you can't get someone to take action who doesn't know you exist, isn't interested, and doesn't have any desire for it.

I like behavior-based funnels best. Bastian Ernst of Wild Audience has a great system for building behavior-based funnels, and he was the most recent guru who sold me a product.

 

[Fox]

This thread really hits home for me.

I don't think there are too many people on here who offer high price courses but its a tough line when you do.
I have priced mine historically from $500-$2,500 and at the moment have close to 150 students.

Basically it is tough cause you know this kind of stuff works, you see everyone else using it, but of course you don't want to be one more passenger on the guru train.
I seen a 10X conference video yesterday where Grant Cardone was being lowered down from the roof on a platform with smoke, lights, and electronic rave music while everyone was cheering. Compare that to the recent reports of the Fastlane meetup where everyone is super low key, approachable, and genuine. I know which one I want to be at.

There is a lot wrong in the coaching/speaker industry. Probably always has been.

My approach moving forwards is to be really open about what I do, who I am, and what the course entails. I have been meaning to start a student thread in here so people can see that some succeed more than others and that a course can only get you so far. Any good course should give the students a place to provide direct and honest feedback.

But... a course is a tool, not a ticket.
Buying into any program (even legit ones) doesn't guarantee success. Neither does enrolling to be a doctor.
You got to show up, do the work, and apply and adjust what you learn.

If you are thinking of getting into teaching I recommend two things:

- Facebook group
Show people what you are about and help as many as you can for free. Build a community and give back as much as you can. I have posted on mine for over an hour a day easy for nearly 1.5 years. Jimmy-guru-webinar won't ever have that kind of track record. If you build it and maintain it they will see you are authentic.

- Youtube Channel.
Facebook has the depth but it doesn't have the reach. You can't have a 100,000 person group and keep order. If you want to get your message in front of a lot of people you need to go somewhere that has the big numbers. A video like "how to build a website" (in my niche) might have 5 million views. No way you can get in front of that amount of people anywhere else. Of course give as much value up front as possible and keep your videos promotion free. The select few who want to know more will seek it out through video links etc.

Also... The Course
You wouldn't knock a video on how to change the oil on your car. Or a detailed video course on how to learn guitar.
My point is real courses that offer clear value exist. Be one of those courses.
Build a program that delivers on what it promises and walks people through all the stages of learning. Provide support and a course community.
Maintain and update the content and make it better from feedback and past student results.

---

Kind of a rant post (!) but it is possible to have a legit course and get your message out there.
Also as a student its possible to take legit courses and see real progress. This thread is a great reference to show you how to decide which is which.

Excellent thread @SinisterLex and I hope it makes an impact on everyone on both sides of the fence here.

 

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[Andy Black]

Here's what @MJ DeMarco wrote back in 2014
(From here.)

I know that zen******* and various others highly recommend learning the skill of copywriting but I don't believe I've ever seen Mj mention it.

You don't see me mention it because I believe your product is more important. Nonetheless, copywriting and the ability to sell is very important, and ranks up there as one of the #1 skills you need to have, and know.

Ultimately, you can have the best product in the world, but if you can't sell it, you will have problems.

Hypothetically imagine for a moment that you had the cure to cancer. Ultimately, you would need to sell the solution. You would need to know how to market. Sell. Convince. Persuade. After the initial momentum builds of sales, the product will do the rest through word of mouth, social media, referrals, and recommendations. Copywriting, marketing, and sales accelerates the momentum. To put it analogous, your product should be the FIRE, your marketing the GAS.

Unfortunately I see copywriting being used to PUSH bad products. Mediocre products. Shitty products. The MARKETING actually becomes the fire, and the product, well, it's just a piece of paper that evaporates once the marketing fire is extinguished. With this type of business model, you're really not dabbling in Fastlanes, but run-of-the-mill internet marketing.

The FASTLANE is not about a PUSH (awesome copy pushing bad products) but a PULL -- creating great products that people want, share, and recommend. And of course, reorder (if you have a product like that.) Marketing/copy should be a tool, not the means to the end.

Most people here want passive income. They mention "printing money" and copywriting as a key to that machine. I'm sorry but I don't want to be "printing money" if my product sucks and I don't believe in it, and yet, I have millions in sales (with a ZERO reorder rate) because my copy is pervasive and borderline deception. That to me isn't Fastlane or entrepreneurship, that just makes you just another money-chasing internet marketer trying to "out push" the other guy down the street.

The IM (internet marketing) industry is RIFE with PUSH marketers. They're fluent in copy, but bankrupt in product. Once they stop advertising and marketing, they cease to exist. Is that printing money? No, you're just a f*cking pusher of commodities.

If you want passive income, I'd be more focused on creating a great product that people want and demand, a product that people will buy not just once because of clever copy, but forever. I mentioned in my INSIDERS call that I've spent less than $3,000 marketing TMF , of which, none of it was effective. (FB rejects all of my ads). TMF has sold over $1,000,000. It will probably add millions to my net worth. Marketing? Copy? No, product. And yes, passive income that has come month after month, year after year.

So to answer your question, YES, copy and sales is important. Is copywriting the end-all-be all for Fastlane? No, believe it or not. If you think it is, you'd probably be better served at the Warrior Forum where those guys sell the same stuff, over and over--- the only thing different between the recycled, rehashed products is the copy that convinced you to buy.

Bottomline, if you have a great product and are also a great salesman, you'll make a fortune AND sleep well. If you have a shitty product and are also a great salesman, well, a big bank account doesn't buy my soul, or my integrity. Maybe your soul can be bribed, mine cannot.

If I had an extra hour a day to learn something, would you suggest learning to write copy?

It depends on what step you are in the process of building and growing a company. Knowing sales, copy, and effective persuasive writing will NEVER hurt you.

As an entrepreneur, you will always be selling to these stakeholders:

-- Potential customers
-- Existing customers who aren't happy
-- Potential investors
-- Potential employees
-- Potential suppliers
-- Potential acquirers

At the end of the day, you will be selling your entire entrepreneurial career in some fashion.

So by all means, learn to sell and communicate effectively.

 

[Vigilante]

You're browsing Facebook when you see a post with a title like this:

The Biggest Mistake That Held Me Back From Hitting My First $1,000,000...
When I first started my business..........

It looks like a blog post. But you see a "read more" icon. So you click it and down pops a story.

​

No harm in reading a story, you think. So you read the first line. But...

...you don't know this harmless sentence ends in a way that opens a loop in the mind that compels you to read more. Before you know it, you've read the third, fourth, and even twenty fifth lines.

By now you know you're reading an ad or maybe not. You may even wonder why you're still reading. But how could you not finish? That's like leaving a murder mystery before the killer is revealed.

When you start a story, you want to finish it.
(unless it sucks like new Star Wars)

When there's a question in your mind, you want to answer it.
(to close the loop)

So you keep reading...

Because the story is good. And it's good because it's about you.

Technically it's the author's story, but strangely, it parallels your own. The struggles, challenges, and failures...it's like you guys live the same lives.

The only part that deviates is where they made 7 figures and you have not.
(yet)

But if you're willing to sit through a Free Master Class, they'll reveal the 5 shifts that changed everything for them and when you get it, your life will change too.

This is how it begins...

Soon you've spent an hour alone watching a guru webinar designed to open your eyes to the error of your ways and show you how simple making millions can be.
(the real purpose is to make you feel good and give you hope)

If only you make those shifts...you'll be rich...and if you want help, the guru (or their team) has set aside time to speak with you to see if you're a fit to work with them to change your life.

But you'd better do it fast because spaces are limited.

So you click a link, fill out an application, and book a call.

Fast forward 3 months and you've spent $10,000 on credit for 8 weeks of training designed to teach you how to do all the things we just talked about. Doesn't matter what you teach in your "business" as long as you follow their "process."
(Also you get access to a Facebook group usually.)

THIS IS HOW GURU CULTS OPERATE...

It's not all that different from a NOT guru cult, which makes it hard to tell the difference. The key difference is one teaches a marketing system as a successful business (but calls it something else). The other teaches processes that open the doors to building a successful business.

Sometimes the funnels they use operate almost exactly the same. The problem with guru cults is they tell you that you can do what you love and be successful while secretly selling you the very system they used to get you to buy from them (rather than selling you their personal processes about how to do what they love and how that made them millions...because it didn't).

It's kind of like an MLM...Juice Plus, Amway, Mary Kay...except people actually do make a lot of money sometimes. As long as you sell the same system you bought to some other poor sap, you'll make back your investment and then some pretty fast (after all it only takes 2 schmoozers at $5,000 each to pay off that $10,000 loan).

At the top levels this works well. The marketing gurus at the top have a lot of money to spend figuring out how to get people to spend money. It works well at the second level too, because the people buying from the top gurus have plenty of money to spend. They get their water from the well. It's when you get to the 3rd level and beyond that things start to go to sh*t.

At the 3rd level you've got marketing training mixed with "business" and "branding" and "spiritual awakenings." Now things start to get muddy. These people still sell the dream, but they don't have as much money to spend on training, or marketing, so they turn to their personal network and start there.

At first they make a few sales from friends or family (this is what the top-tier gurus suggest they do to gain traction fast). But soon they run out of people to sell to and they stop making money.

So they turn back to the marketing systems. They try Facebook ads but don't have much to spend, so it doesn't work very well. They try promoting themselves all over Facebook and social media but that doesn't work well either. Also, by this time it's been so long since they first started this path, that they forgot half the sh*t they learned in their training...

The only logical solution therefore is to return to their guru because they've "tried everything" but something still holds them back (you'll find that line in their customer emails). Lucky for them, the guru is hosting a 2 day seminar in the Himalayas and it's just $30,000 to attend................

Anyone notice a pattern?

Anyway...

There are plenty of legit coaches, courses and trainings out there. There's also a f*ck ton of bullshit gurus and wannabes selling crackpot systems they don't understand to people they can't help.

In the posts that follow (and when I have time) I'm going to break down each part of the guru funnels, and the tactics and techniques they use to indoctrinate you into their cults and keep you there while practically stealing your cash.

Hopefully this thread will save some of you a lot of wasted time and cash, and help you make good judgments and buying decisions anytime you consider a training moving forward.

WHERE DID I GET THESE SECRET INSIGHTS?

I've worked directly with gurus at all levels. Built their funnels. Wrote their copy. Trained their students, and even launched courses and coaching programs of my own using some of their methods.

Also, I've bought courses from gurus, and through a rigorous process of due diligence have managed to only purchase useful sh*t up to this point. So hopefully some of those insights will help you.

Anyway, if you have any questions about gurus, or about a program you're considering taking, feel free to post them here. It's been a while since I spent time giving value to this forum, and this seems like a fair way to give back.

Even if you don't have questions right now, maybe you'll learn something from the posts that follow.

In the next post we'll look at some guru ads and break down different psychological tactics of influence and persuasion used to pull you in and suck you dry.

If that interests you, stay tuned...

P.S.

Look again at the ad above. Is it a BS guru, or does she sell a legit training program that might be useful for you? Consider it carefully. I'll tell you the answer in the next post.

@Andy Black @MJ DeMarco

Could you move this to the outside. Sorry about that. Thought I double checked and had it in the right forum.

This post to me feels like an exorcist has arrived to purge the demons. It's a much-needed breath of fresh air to purge the bad Guru Juju from our midst. Your timing on this post was impeccable and the content is excellent. What a wonderful restorative helpful thread. Excellent post. Speed+

There is something deliciously restorative for the Forum right now about an anti Guru coming in here with actual first-hand experience. No wonder this thread was moved to gold within 24 hours of its posting.

You might have to change your sn to ExorcistLex.

 

[Sadik]

Thanks @SinisterLex for posting this. This thread has pushed me out of my forum hibernation...

I actually was subsribed to Selena's newsletter for a long time. I didn't buy her S2 Groupe program but I was tempted several times. For those who don't know, Selena started out as a student of Ramit Sethi from his Zero to Launch course (Another course, I was tempted several times to buy, but didn't). In my opinion both Ramit and Selena are legit. But like you said, value one gets is dependent on your own current level of progress.

I have actually worked as a Developer for another "Cult Guru" for two years making his website, creating those funnels etc. From my experience, I can tell people here ONE important point of difference between REAL gurus following whom can change your lives versus FAKE ones where you will just lose money.

It is the section in their sales landing page, which specifically lists the contents / modules of their course /membership.

Follow the below process.

1> Get to their Sales landing page. Ignore all the persuasion/ psychological speak and scroll down/find a section called "Modules in the course" or similarly titled. This should be a section in the sales page where they list what actually is contained in their course.
2> If the above is missing, it is a CERTAIN, 100% Proof that the course and the guru is B.S. His course will be vague, general talk points which will waste your money.
3> If there IS a section on the Sales page which lists the modules/contents of the course, pay VERY close attention to what it is. You have to ask two important questions here,

a> AM I getting anything tangible here?

For example, a course with an associated iPhone / Android App, which records your progress/actions IS TANGIBLE. A course with just 8 different "mindshifts" videos you have to see is NOT tangible.
Documents / Spreadsheets by themselves are not tangible. But documents in which your actions can be recorded / tracked or information contained in them is actionable (like exact steps which can save you days of time) are tangible.

b> What actions will I have to take during the modules/course/membership?

A Real Guru's sales page will identify or at least point you towards what exact steps you will have to take. Even if the course is just 8 videos, you should be able to understand what you have to do.

If you cannot understand what you have to do during the course before buying it, then the course is B.S.

IF you can understand the actions you will have to take, and understand that the course will NOT work if you don't take the said actions, then the course is probably legit.

This is the exact technique I use before deciding whether to buy something. I ignore almost the entire sales pitch and focus on above, what I also consider as technical information. Since I am a developer who has to work with many management type people, the above is basically the difference between someone who is just blowing out air versus someone who knows what they are talking about and can guide / teach you.

Thanks again @SinisterLex. Much appreciated for this thread.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

I just finished watching this, its incredible!! To think even after famous cases like the Jim Jones "Kool-Aid" Guru people still fall into cults such as this.

Well, they usually don't put a sign up that reads "Welcome to the cult"

Many people who wind up part of a cult believe they'd be the last person to wind up in a cult.

In fact, you're in a type of cult right now. It isn't a dangerous cult, but you can certainly see the parallels. You purchased a book and read it alone. Just you and the author and his words. You were awakened to a hidden truth and then you were given a chance to explore deeper.

You took that chance and made your way into the community -- a community of like minded individuals with deep conviction about right and wrong in regards to how to be successful. Victim mindset is bad. Fastlane mindset is good. etc.

Going a step further, you have the chance to open yourself up and put yourself out there. You can post progress threads. You're encouraged to share your wins and failures. In doing so, you become more deeply ingrained in the community. Eventually maybe you become an INSIDERS and deepen your commitment further.

As long as you conform and post things the community likes, you're welcome to stay. You'll be rewarded. You'll gain likes and followers. You'll gain praise and friendship. As long as you contribute to the cult leader's empire, you're a valued member of the team.

But if you start posting things in opposition to the group norms, things will quickly change. Suddenly people will be against you. You'll risk shame and negativity. In some cases you even risk excommunication.

There was no sign that said, "Welcome to the Cult."

The key difference here is that this community is based on value, and you can leave anytime you want. Sometimes people even promote that course of action. In dangerous cults, everything else follows a similar path, but when you decide to leave, that's when shit gets ugly.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

Reposted from the latest forum guru thread:

I don't know what defines a guru to you, but if someone were to post an AMA thread, then would they look like a guru, smell like a guru or act like a guru?

I'm guessing you would say yes.

If you knew me, then you would never class me as a BS guru. But I guess all of the gurus say that right?

First, I didn't "class" you as a guru. I mocked you because other people classed you as a guru. But now you have my attention, and even though the burden of proof is not on me to prove you are a guru, now I just want to.

You know why you don't know what defines a guru to me? Because you didn't get to know me...

• Did you post an introduction to get to know the forum?
• Have you posted a high value AMA explaining your exact process?

Now let's break down your post so others can see just now "not a guru" you are...

Direct link: How to make money with a website - 60% - 80% Opt In Landing Page Conversion Rate Optimization

Before adding any value, you post a link off site to your funnel.

Anyone who has a website knows how important it is to grow your email list.

You open with a generalization designed to lump everyone into a category and gain agreement.

Email marketing is one of the easiest ways to get your message read by tens of thousands (if not hundreds of thousands) of people who want to buy the products and services you offer.

Here you attempt to use big numbers indirectly for credibility, but fail because they're posted as words instead of numeric values.

Best of all, it's 100% free advertising and in 2018, the average business will get 40X ROI for every penny spent acquiring their list (in other words: spend $1 and you make $40).

Here you make a statement that can't be proven untrue, and even if people in your funnel don't get those results, you're still not to blame because they must have done something wrong. -- a cult tactic so shame and guilt can be applied at a later time.

It's for this reason that you see sooo many posts about how to grow your list and why there are so many tools and apps available to help you achieve this goal.

Here you attempt to imply that your post is not the same as all of those other posts. Yours is somehow different -- which also implies there must be some secret or mystery to your method that sets it apart.

However, popups, sticky bars or whatever else you happen to be using is only one small part of what you need to succeed.

Here you imply that there is something more that we need beyond those things to succeed -- a type of open loop that begs the question, "what could it be?"

In this video, you'll discover how to rapidly grow your email list with an opt-in landing page that has a 60% - 80% conversion rate.

Here you make a vague statement about what's possible, in other words future pacing how great life will be after watching your video (which leads directly into your funnel).

It's so effective, that I used it to help one of my clients to get 394 new email subscribers (including key decision makers from international brands) in less than 6-days... from free traffic.

Here you attempt to establish more credibility by vaguely mentioning social proof. I'm surprised you didn't name drop your clients to make it more impactful. Also you mention "big" numbers again in a very short time period indicating how easy it is to do this, and free.

One of the easiest ways to make money with a website is to master opt in landing page conversion rate optimization and knowing how to build an email list.

Over the past 12 years, I've helped hundreds of clients from around the world to grow their business online including Noah Kagan, Neil Patel, Ezra Firestone and Sujan Patel.

Instead of sharing anything of value, you just make a repost talking about your "hundreds" of clients -- another big number before name dropping a bunch of well-known marketers.

I led the growth team at Roadtrippers where I help them to achieve 3-million active users and at FOMO we got a conservative evaluation of $2.6 million in less than 6 months.

More big numbers for credibility that no one is likely to question.

When people hear about my experience, they LOVE asking how to to make money with a website:

“Hey Chris, tell me how to get more Shopify sales”
“Dude, what's the fastest way to get more clients?”
“Okay, answer this real quick: fastest way to get more customers?”
"I really need your help. What's the fastest way to get more sales online?"

Here you use a bunch of probably fake questions that nobody has ever asked you, and certainly nobody from this forum asked because nobody knows you here.

The answer is actually very simple. All you need is email subscribers.

I'm sure it is...but no, all you need is NOT email subs to make money. Sorry, there's real people behind the screen.

Today, I'm sharing my insights in this small business guide to opt in landing page conversion rate optimization.

In this video you’ll learn step-by-step how to quickly build an email list from scratch with a lead gen landing page that has a 60% - 80% opt in conversion rate.

As if we're all so stupid we wouldn't realize this is your lead magnet...

I don't know what defines a guru to you, but if someone were to post an AMA thread, then would they look like a guru, smell like a guru or act like a guru?

I'm guessing you would say yes.

If you knew me, then you would never class me as a BS guru. But I guess all of the gurus say that right?

Back to this...instead of accepting that your post reads exactly like a direct response marketing guru's post and using that opportunity to make adjustments, introduce yourself to the forum, and post an actual AMA so people can decide if you're valuable (or not)...you go straight to defensive tactics (what all gurus do) and launch a personal campaign against the people who say you're a guru.

If someone posted a thread saying "How do I get more email subscribers?" and someone were to share their experience and expertise in order to help the poster, then would the person be classed as a guru?

You didn't do that. You posted a gateway into a marketing funnel in a way that reads like a marketing funnel and put the burden of proof on us to watch your video. If you knew anything about value creation, converting people, or engaging your audience, you wouldn't have approached our forum this way at all.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I literally had no idea that an automation was running for that.

You don't even know how your own funnel operates, but you're teaching others...

Conclusion?

You are a guru.
(just not a very good one)

A Tier 3 guru who doesn't know anything about value creation. You've spent time reading up on all the big names like Neil Patel and following exactly what they say and believing that that's how you should talk to other people to get them to respond.

Funny thing is, Patel and Halpern are Tier 1 gurus, and they talk that way to sell to Tier 3 gurus like you.

If you want to know more about Tier 3 gurus, you can read my 4th GOLD thread here.

That's called an open loop by the way. Also notice how I added relevant credibility.

I'm sure they taught you that though...

No more responses from me though. The forum saw through your post before I even got tagged. Now it's up to them to decide. Personally, I decided not to watch your video because writing this post already wasted enough time.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Damn, this thread continues to deliver, can't upgrade it any further!

This story applies a therapeutic metaphor technique to bypass any reservations you currently have.

You may not know this, but people understand things through other things. If I just say you're being targeted by gurus, that doesn't describe the severity of the situation. But if I call a guru an assassin and you the victim, or them a lion and you the antelope...that paints a clearer picture in your mind. You understand the comparison.

Excellent. Part of this is being raw and "authentic" to the point of appearing vulnerable. We can't say that about a certain other individual who shall not be named. The vulnerability and conffession helps us identify with the guru, and when that happens, the hook has just got in your mouth.

 

[Fox]

I made a gif just for @SinisterLex:

 

[Lex DeVille]

Please watch this until the song ends, then we'll talk.

I asked you to watch first because I want you to really notice how this makes you feel. Maybe you're a stone cold douche who feels nothing. I'd wager most who see this find themselves with "something in my eye."

It takes seconds.

You feel it before the end of the first sentence of the song. Your cheeks tense. An icy chill washes down your back. Your arm hair raises. Goosebumps cover your body. Feels like cold water pumped into your veins.

You don't know this guy or his brother, but somehow...you're connected. You feel his emotions, his sorrow. His heartache is yours, and you feel it deep inside your bones.

What the hell is going on? Why are your fists clasped in front of your mouth? Why are there little pools in the corners of your eyes? None of this is an accident.

It's all by design.

The story is tragic. How it's used is borderline unethical. Television networks know people spend their days at work, droning out, feeling nothing. So when they come home and watch something that makes them feel, suddenly they're connected. They're tuned in. They tasted the high that is emotion, and they want more. So we see more and more reality shows exploiting stories of tragedy and darkness.

But this is about guru tactics...

So today I wanted to point out how in less than 5 seconds you were likely brought to the brink of tears. A direct demonstration of how easy it can be to manipulate emotions by applying simple psychological triggers and techniques. The very same techniques gurus use every day to bypass your defenses.

PRE-SUASION
How did the first 5 seconds of the song move you? They didn't. You were already in motion before you reached the song. A pre-suasion trigger was applied first. As soon as you heard the words "for my brother, who passed away when I was only young." Your mind was primed for a tear jerker story. Without taking a deep dive into neuroscience, just know that a whole bunch of psychological shit was happening in your head after that point.

TRANCE INDUCTION
All attention is focused on the singer. Nothing else but the man and his guitar. As we discussed previously, focused attention is the only requirement of trance induction. Upon entering a trance state, the mind becomes open and vulnerable. The first strum of his guitar sets the tone and we already have the context of the story that's to come. The first strum is a lot like Pavlov's bell.

FIRST PERSON JOURNEY
"I would do anything" -- puts you directly behind the eyes of the artist. You're in his shoes and because you're already in a trance, you can imagine where these 4 words lead next. You anticipate they're not leading to a happy place. The word "anything" adds weight to the gravity of the situation. This is a serious matter fueled by authentic emotion.

AGE REGRESSION
"to be two years old again" -- You've been placed in his shoes. You see through his eyes. Now he takes you inside your imagination. This is a form of hypnosis. Not intentional on the part of the artist (I suspect). Suddenly you're not sitting on your couch eating Doritos. You're a two year old boy thinking about your brother who you haven't lost yet, but soon will. Note how you can likely visualize this, though the memories do not belong to you.

HYPNOTIC LANGUAGE PATTERNS & NLP TIMELINING
"Imagine what we could've done." -- The word "imagine" is a trance deepener. The line uses vague language to begin a new story in the future. So now you've bounced from present, to past, to a future in a timeline that doesn't belong to you. You're in someone else's head, experiencing their thoughts, memories and emotions as though they were your own.

These are the same therapeutic techniques which are intended to help people overcome phobias and other problems in their lives. They're also the same techniques cult leaders and gurus use to grab your attention, give you the feels, play with your mind and ultimately, attempt to control your actions.

ALL THE OTHER TACTICS AND TECHNIQUES
At this point the song moves from vague to specific language, creating a clear picture of the artist's story in your mind. He describes specific details, and applies sensory language such as the words "squeezing my hand" which you can almost feel... By now you're hooked. In fact, you're more than hooked. It's like clutching a truck's tailgate as it speeds down the highway. You're barely holding on, and you're just along for the ride.

We don't need to go any deeper into the song. We could talk about the camera play, and video editing that draws your attention to the judge's thoughts and feelings. But there's no need. Just beware that your emotions, and even your physical bodily functions can be manipulated in a matter of seconds (especially in a controlled setting).

Gurus know this. They count on it. They do not sell logic. They sell feelings, and then they help you justify your purchase with reasoning (often flawed).

Pay attention when someone tells you to imagine something. Not to what they're saying, but to what they're doing with their words.

• "Imagine" is a trance induction and trance deepener
• Talking about the past might be small talk or might be age regression
• Talking about the future might be head canon or might be future pacing or timelining
• Vague language might indicate a big picture thinker, or a hypnosis practitioner
• Specific language might indicate a detail-focused thinker, or they might be taking you for a ride.

 

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