Vegan / Vegetarians Only (Chat about lifestyle, opportunities, food, whatever...)

[ZackerySprague]

The word I used "Sad" was not the correct terminology for my post after what I saw. I take it back.

 

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[ZackerySprague]

"Sad" is too little of a word to describe the unspeakable horror an animal experiences under the diabolical circumstances of factory farming.

This is the closest thing that resembles HELL that we were capable of bringing here on earth. It's not too far from the atrocities we've done in the past century - and in some cases, I would say it's even worse.

The only reason why factory farming is still legal and widely practiced is because the general public is blindly unaware of the heinous crimes being committed over there - false imprisonment, torture, and mass murder.

Educating the masses is the only way to stop factory farming.

---

I am not a vegan myself, but I wholeheartedly support the mission of stopping unnecessary animal cruelty.

Killing an animal is still killing an animal. And some would argue that there is no "humane" way of doing it.

But I think everything is on a spectrum, and there is a huge difference between raising cows with love in a traditional family ranch where they live the best life possible vs. committing unspeakable acts of violence and mass murder in a modern concentration camp.

Your right. I shouldn't have said "Sad".

 

[Spenny]

I don't have the guts to click on dominion because I know what I will see there...

As I've said to Zackary, you owe it to the animals to watch it. They give their lives up for you, and you can't spare two hours?

On one hand I can continue to support a nation of mini hittlers that all make money with mini auschwitzes that are state supported.

It's not a mini Auschwitz. It's not comparable.

Auschwitz killed 200,000 people every year for five years. We slaughter 92 billion animals a year. It's the equivalent of 460,000 Auschwitz. It's not even comparable.

Yep, so now after sitting on this post for a whole day, it's done. I am a vegetarian now.

I'd still be cautious. The fate of many dairy cows and laying hens is just as bad as that of meat. Watch Dominion, in full, not skipping around.

Now I need some good meals to eat that do not involve meat.

It's surprisingly easy. I have suggestions at the beginning of the post.

But I think everything is on a spectrum, and there is a huge difference between raising cows with love in a traditional family ranch where they live the best life possible vs. committing unspeakable acts of violence and mass murder in a modern concentration camp.

This is a common argument, and this is the case for 0.00000000001% of cows that are born. In mathematical differentiation, we'd neglect this term because of how small it is, because it makes no difference to the equation.

Sure, I'd love this luxury, but the supply cannot facilitate the demand for this product

 

[Subsonic]

As I've said to Zackary, you owe it to the animals to watch it. They give their lives up for you, and you can't spare two hours?

It's not a mini Auschwitz. It's not comparable.

Auschwitz killed 200,000 people every year for five years. We slaughter 92 billion animals a year. It's the equivalent of 460,000 Auschwitz. It's not even comparable.


I'd still be cautious. The fate of many dairy cows and laying hens is just as bad as that of meat. Watch Dominion, in full, not skipping around.

It's surprisingly easy. I have suggestions at the beginning of the post.

I am changing my non meat animal consumption to those of humane origin, I have seen a full industrial dairy farm first hand.


I'll see if I can muster up the courage to watch the documentary. It is the right thing to do.

 

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[Spenny]

I am changing my non meat animal consumption to those of humane origin

Sadly, much of what you see it marketing. Here is what I mean with British regulation:

"Organic" & "RSPCA assured!"

• Requirements 9 chickens (the size of cats) per 1m^2. Measure out a meter by a meter. Would you put nine full cats in there?
• Needs to be let out every 12 weeks. WTF? Would you let yourself out every three months?

"Made in Britain!"

• Doesn't matter if they're from Turkey or Japan. They still live in awful conditions.

Not to mention that once these birds can't lay anymore, or don't lay enough, they are killed for meat.

Once you look into this, marketing like this looks disgusting.

Our farms | The Happy Egg Co

Our farmers work hard to provide the happiest homes for our girls. Providing a calming and enriching environment for them means they lay their tastiest and most nutritious eggs for you to enjoy.

thehappyegg.co.uk

Happy eggs? It seems so Orwellian. I've not seen one tour, the only photo I can get is this

Don't question. Buy the product.

These animals didn't ask to be imprisoned. Dairy cows are far worse.

 

[Jon822]

Yeah there is no such thing as ethical animal products. Giving them more space than they need lowers profits and even if you gave an entire field to one cow, there is no ethical way to slaughter a sentient being that just wants to live a happy life. "Minimizing" suffering just doesn't cut it when you're talking about slitting it's throat to bleed out.

 

[Matt Sun]

Man I should post my blood test, it was freaking perfect (except for b12 was a little low, I had neglected it and since fixed).

It's really not that hard, mostly about spinach and broccoli and the right condiments and it tastes amazing (just devoured some lentil + pasta + spinach + broccoli and other veggies moments ago, curry and baharat are your friend, also smashed avocado for it to be really creamy).

I even tend to forget the not hurting of animals, after all, some birds and rodents do die to protect the crops. But the systematic torturing and murdering of billions of sentient beings in artificial prisons for pleasure or muh protein it's really something else, glad that I don't participate since many years thanks for the reminder Spenny.

Just a final thought: I remember my dad which is a huge meat eater, calling the police on somebody mistreating a horse. And I tought well what it's the difference between that horse and the animal in your plate ? And concluded that we all are kind of instinctually vegan, but we just get disconnected from the reality of meat.

 

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[S.Y.]

Question for all vegans/vegetarians: do you take any supplements that you consider essential to take?
I read b12 is a must for vegans?

 

[Jon822]

Question for all vegans/vegetarians: do you take any supplements that you consider essential to take?
I read b12 is a must for vegans?

I add nutritional yeast that is fortified with b12. Technically speaking, there is at least one plant food that contains b12 but it's easier just to supplement. Aside from this, I take no supplements or protein powders. If I know I'm not going to eat well on a given day, I'll take a multivitamin that includes b12. A multivitamin is also a great thing to include for someone new to plant based.

 

[Matt Sun]

Question for all vegans/vegetarians: do you take any supplements that you consider essential to take?
I read b12 is a must for vegans?

I take b12. Did you know animal products have b12 because they give the supplement to the animal ?

So either you take the pill, or the cow takes the pill and you get it through the cows flesh. Just cut the middle man/animal and take the pill...

 

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[S.Y.]

I take b12. Did you know animal products have b12 because they give the supplement to the animal ?

So either you take the pill, or the cow takes the pill and you get it through the cows flesh. Just cut the middle man/animal and take the pill...

I didn't know. Thanks @Jon822 and @Matt Sun.

I am eating meat. In fact, I increased my meat consumption recently to increase my protein intake. I read a lot about the importance of muscle on healthspan and lifespan to convince me to bulk up a bit. But this thread has convinced me to reduce my meat consumption and see how I feel. I will start tomorrow.

 

[Timmy C]

Doing some plant based meal prep for weekly lunches.

Quinoa, lentils, Beans, and chick peas tossed with fresh broccoli, onion, pumpkin, capsicum and zucchini mixed with turmeric powder and lemon juice.

The lemon juice gives it a nice fresh, zesty flavour.

It's delicious.

I made up some overnight oats aswell, blend up the oats with soy milk in the ninja bullet and add fresh blueberries and strawberries with a touch of honey.

The honey isn't needed if you want it vegan, but it's easy to prepare and you can just store it for breakfast over the next few days.

 

[Jon822]

"Gee, my health is literally shit from 5 months on the carnivore diet. Did I just not fast long enough?"

Yeah, you need to fast for a long enough period of time that your body can recover from the literal garbage you've been giving it.

It's worth noting that the reference numbers they use are based on averages, so even being in green wouldn't be very comforting. "You're right around average compared to the typical overweight, slowly dying American. Keep it up!"

It's sad because a lot of these people are genuinely trying to live healthier lives and they don't know how unhealthy it actually is.

 

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[Timmy C]

It would be best if you kept watching. Pay some respects to at least knowing where your food comes from. You owe it to the animals you buy.

I forced myself for another hour. I'm going to watch the rest in the coming days.

I haven't gone full plant based yet, but I did just finish watching it, and let me tell you...

It is one of the most saddening and horrific things I have seen.

I paused it on multiple occasions and had a break as it was too much for me at times.

Far from humane, we are savage creatures jeezus.

 

[KJFast]

I’m plant based and can’t stand action/horror films as my psyche likes being clean. Is dominion still worth a watch? I do not enjoy gore or anything of the sort and I’m completely set staying plant based. Meat disgusts me

 

[Spenny]

I’m plant based and can’t stand action/horror films as my psyche likes being clean. Is dominion still worth a watch? I do not enjoy gore or anything of the sort and I’m completely set staying plant based. Meat disgusts me

I found it incredibly hard to watch. If you're already plant based, there is no point scarring yourself further.

I thought I was okay after watching just half of it. Nope. I saw a flatmate cutting up a store bought chicken, that alongside the sound of a knife being sharpened, was enough to raise my heart rate and make me breathe faster. That has never happened to me before.

Edit: I've skinned and gutted fish, chickens & pheasants. I've never been squeemish.

 

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[Timmy C]

Does anyone have a recommendation for plant based books that provide recipes and potentially anything specifically made for athletes?

 

[MTF]

Does anyone have a recommendation for plant based books that provide recipes and potentially anything specifically made for athletes?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08J3YYP2M/?tag=tff-amazonparser-20 - this one is more general

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HY4X4XL/?tag=tff-amazonparser-20 - this one is more for runners

But you can just as well google "high-protein vegan recipes."

 

[MJ DeMarco]

I posted this in the Random Chat thread but I know a lot of you here will relate...

 

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[Spenny]

Eddie Abbew on Instagram: "The world watched a documentary on Netflix called The Game Changer. The gist of the documentary was that it was healthier to eat plant based foods that it was to eat meat and animal products. I experimented with myself. I

113K likes, 5,790 comments - eddie_abbew on February 12, 2024: "The world watched a documentary on Netflix called The Game Changer. The gist of the documentary was that it was healthier to eat plant ba...".

www.instagram.com

I'm blown away by how I will hear the same arguments repeatedly from different people who never met one another. I thought announcing you're an entrepreneur was bad - classifying yourself as plant-based is another level.

Since when was it trendy to be not be compassionate?

 

[Timmy C]

Eddie Abbew on Instagram: "The world watched a documentary on Netflix called The Game Changer. The gist of the documentary was that it was healthier to eat plant based foods that it was to eat meat and animal products. I experimented with myself. I

113K likes, 5,790 comments - eddie_abbew on February 12, 2024: "The world watched a documentary on Netflix called The Game Changer. The gist of the documentary was that it was healthier to eat plant ba...".

www.instagram.com

I'm blown away by how I will hear the same arguments repeatedly from different people who never met one another. I thought announcing you're an entrepreneur was bad - classifying yourself as plant-based is another level.

Since when was it trendy to be not be compassionate?

I can relate to him feeling worse, as I did go vegan for a couple of months a couple of years ago and I felt very lethargic.
I think it has to do with how people go vegan, and probably a withdrawal from the meat that is similar to drugs.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Since when was it trendy to be not be compassionate?

You will drive yourself nuts watching people like this.

He wants to win the muscle and vanity game, I want to win longevity -- I want to be active in my 90s, not a good looking corpse in a coffin by 63.

I can relate to him feeling worse, as I did go vegan for a couple of months a couple of years ago and I felt very lethargic.

I tried quitting cigarettes and alcohol, I felt like shit!

 

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[Timmy C]

I tried quitting cigarettes and alcohol, I felt like shit!

lol, yeh probably.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

It would be best if you kept watching.

It is one of the most saddening and horrific things I have seen.

You guys are braver than I. I refuse to watch the whole thing as it will leave me extremely traumatized while leveling-up my hatred for humanity.

I can't even walk through the meat department of a grocery store without getting teary-eyed.

The meat "clearance rack" really upsets me ... some poor creature had to unnecessarily die to likely end up in a garbage can... imagine if it was your family pet that was killed for "well, we need to kill Fluffy because its for our survival" only to have their body diced up in cellophane and thrown in a stinking landfill.

And some would argue that there is no "humane" way of doing it.

This is not an argument and just a popular, pervasive lie to make people feel better.

There is no way to kill something "humanely" that doesn't want to be killed and instinctually will do anything to survive.

Giving me a nice massage before you slit my throat is not humane.

Everything else is window dressing so the normies can keep the cognitive dissonance managed.

Hugo, Váldes and Little were their names. Every single one of them was a precious goofball, and teaching them tricks was amazing. Standing in the stable and then feeling Hugo the 1000 Pound Stallion try to sneakily eat the carrots I had in my jacket was indescribable.
They aren't all that different from cows, of which I've eaten several in the last year.

Just a final thought: I remember my dad which is a huge meat eater, calling the police on somebody mistreating a horse. And I tought well what it's the difference between that horse and the animal in your plate ? And concluded that we all are kind of instinctually vegan, but we just get disconnected from the reality of meat.

People who say "I love animals" are the most hypocritical, but have done a spectacular job of compartmentalizing their hypocrisy.

No, you love certain animals, the animals in which your culture has labeled as not taste-worthy, or the animals which are cute and cuddly, or have been lucky enough to be given a NAME.

Every other animal serves your selfish purposes.

Funny how animals outside the slaughterhouse who are given names and cared for are sentient and worth saving, but put them in the factory-farmed concentration camp and they become unthinking, unfeeling commodities.

The ability of human beings to compartmentalize their empathy and selective outrage is amazing.

And this is just one example why I don't fear my government, I fear the average citizen who blindly follows whatever their government feeds them, literally and figuratively. It's how holocausts occur.

And if the government happens to label you in the same "livestock" box as factory farmed animals, don't expect your average human to figure it out. Say hello to Holocaust 2.0 where you've become a disposable commodity.

I read b12 is a must for vegans?

B12 is a must for all humans.

Animals get their B12 mostly through supplementation. Bypass the middleman.

BTW, I take vegan pre-workout supplements which contain B12 so I tend to get it as they are complementary to my workouts. My last B12 measurement was borderline HIGH, not LOW.

 

[Spenny]

And if the government happens to label you in the same "livestock" box as factory farmed animals, don't expect your average human to figure it out. Say hello to Holocaust 2.0 where you've become a disposable commodity.

Exactly so. I see a lot of arguments of "because I can't understand them, that makes it justified" or "Well, they're less intelligent than us". It becomes a slippery slope that leads to classifying people as what deserves to live or what deserves to die. Eugenics follows the same practice, which is what fueled much of nazi ideologues.

The other shocking thing is the lack of critical thinking, the appeals to authority, the poor argumentative skills, the contradictions & poor understanding of chemistry. It's a great failing that schools haven't engaged people to think critically about the garbage they are fed, not just for animals but a whole range of topics.

 

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[MTF]

Pro tip for any new vegans: don't become a vegan activist. People will hate you, you won't convince them, and you'll waste your time.

If you want to convince people, demonstrate this through how you look, perform, and feel. The only way to inspire people to consider changing their habits is to see someone their age or older who's way healthier or looks way better.

Sadly (or not), appeals to vanity work way better than appeals to morality.

This is also why it's so important to be a healthy vegan and not become a junk food addicted vegan Karen. Plant-based alone doesn't make it healthy.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Pro tip for any new vegans: don't become a vegan activist. People will hate you, you won't convince them, and you'll waste your time.

If you want to convince people, demonstrate this through how you look, perform, and feel. The only way to inspire people to consider changing their habits is to see someone their age or older who's way healthier or looks way better.

Agreed.

The best "activism" I ever did was posting my new avatar, LOL.

On another note; I tried for 30 years to get six-pack abs and a "stripper-like" physique in my 20s 30s, and 40s .... looks like I needed to become plant-based and 55 years old to make that happen.

I will post a pic when I get there, I finally got the stomach flat, just need the abs to come out.

 

[MTF]

Agreed.

The best "activism" I ever did was posting my new avatar, LOL.

On another note; I tried for 30 years to get six-pack abs and a "stripper-like" physique in my 20s 30s, and 40s .... looks like I needed to become plant-based and 55 years old to make that happen.

I will post a pic when I get there, I finally got the stomach flat, just need the abs to come out.

I would really, really appreciate your workout plan (or an average week of your physical activity) and your average diet (do you count calories, macros, what do you eat, etc.).

 

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[MJ DeMarco]

I would really, really appreciate your workout plan (or an average week of your physical activity) and your average diet (do you count calories, macros, what do you eat, etc.).

I don't count calories.
I don't count macros.

I'm not militant about anything.

I stretch daily.
I jump rope daily.
Inversion table, daily.
I do 2 upperbody workouts per week, rapid sets.
1 lower body workout per week.
So three days of strength training, 4 days of rest and/or IM fasting. (18-36 hours, random/detox).
3 infared saunas per week (detox)

I try to make all my workouts breathless.

No cardio, unless you count the jump rope which is both aerobic and anaerobic.

My wife cooks the meals so I can't give you much details other than everything she cooks is healthy and truly plant-based with minimal processing.

On days I'm strength training, I try to double my protein intake, other than that, I probably get about 60g daily which in fitness/muscle realms, is terribly low.

Excess protein stimulates growth (and muscle repair), but it also promotes accelerated aging by activating mTor which I witnessed firsthand in my late 30s and 40s when I went from someone who always looked pretty young, to rapidly aging (thanks Keto/Carnivore!) [This is why meat-heads in their 40s and 50s look terribly aged, thank mTor and their inability to get into a state of autophagy which is a detox/cleansing mechanism.]

My wife is also an ardent follower of Bryan Johnson (the eccentric millionaire who is 45 and has a biological age of 18 due to extensive testing and longevity protocols) and is militantly trying to follow his Blueprint protocol.

So I'm a beneficiary of that program.

 

[MTF]

I don't count calories.
I don't count macros.

I'm not militant about anything.

I stretch daily.
I jump rope daily.
Inversion table, daily.
I do 2 upperbody workouts per week, rapid sets.
1 lower body workout per week.
So three days of strength training, 4 days of rest and/or IM fasting. (18-36 hours, random/detox).
3 infared saunas per week (detox)

I try to make all my workouts breathless.

No cardio, unless you count the jump rope which is both aerobic and anaerobic.

My wife cooks the meals so I can't give you much details other than everything she cooks is healthy and truly plant-based with minimal processing.

On days I'm strength training, I try to double my protein intake, other than that, I probably get about 60g daily which in fitness/muscle realms, is terribly low.

Excess protein stimulates growth (and muscle repair), but it also promotes accelerated aging by activating mTor which I witnessed firsthand in my late 30s and 40s when I went from someone who always looked pretty young, to rapidly aging (thanks Keto/Carnivore!)

My wife is also an ardent follower of Bryan Johnson (the eccentric millionaire who is 45 and has a biological age of 18 due to extensive testing and longevity protocols) and is militantly trying to follow his Blueprint protocol.

So I'm a beneficiary of that program.

That is crazy and shows that you can do way better keeping things as simple as possible rather than listening to another 2-hour podcast with a fitness influencer on how to micro-manage every little thing about your diet, exercise, and daily routine.